Pigs are the highest maintenance food animal. They get sick a lot, they die for no fucking reason, they destroy everything they can, and they kill their young. Fuck pigs. Most of the factory farms people talk about don't really exist. The pictures are usually of short term holding pens and feedlots near the feed troughs. One exception is chickens, and the worst of those are pretty much all owned by one company that a lot of people have been trying to shut down for a while.
lolwut Aren't supposed to be? What does that mean? Because back in cave man days, chickens were free to roam around like nature intended? The chicken that makes it to the shelf in your grocery store has been bred and raised as food. You're not eating some wild chicken that's been forced into farm life. From egg hatch to being ready for food is about 8 weeks. It's not like they live a five year miserable life in a pow camp. Animals that don't move much produce more white meat - that's why chicken legs are dark meat, non-flying breasts are white meat. (Farm turkey breast, white meat; wild turkey breast dark meat.)
I love me some steak and bacon so don't take this as a defensive vegetarian speaking here. But arguing that vegetarians are stupid because we evolved to eat meat is about as ridiculous as it gets. We're conscious, intelligent beings capable of making our own choices, and I suspect - though it's just a theory, mind you - that we all make decisions every day that directly conflict with our evolutionary impulses. Unless you're all hunting your own food, mating with multiple partners to produce children, etc. In regards to antibiotic use, the difference is between widespread feeding of antibiotics to livestock as a preventative measure, and treating specific outbreaks with medication. The former is bad because overuse of antibiotics is reducing their effectiveness, and it's especially bad because the low residual doses are exactly what bacteria need to develop resistance. Most farms that are "antibiotic free" don't stop using antibiotics entirely, they just segregate animals that are sick and being treated with them. If stopping the use of preventative antibiotics caused such a drastic crash in production, there's something wrong with their operation or they simply had bad luck and experienced an abnormal outbreak.
I work in the meat industry. The turkeys are put to sleep before they're slaughtered. The process is about everything you could ask for humane wise. And the farm conditions look nothing like the images on those self righteous websites. The only time they're really packed in tight is when they're being shipped, and if you want people to run an extra ten trips per load so the turkeys can roam around on their way to the slaughter house I hope one of those trucks runs you over. I don't care if someone wants to be a vegetarian, but the worst argument I ever got into with one was over this issue. They were trying to claim that human teeth are more similar to cow teeth than badger teeth therefore humans aren't omnivores. I don't think I could even conceive of a dumber argument. Aside from the fact that our teeth are nothing like cow teeth you'd be hard pressed to find a mammal with a digestive system more different than our own. I pointed out the hundreds of thousands of years of hunting tools located with hominid fossils, chimps/Neanderthals being omnivores (you know, species actually closely related to us), and the fact that we lived as hunter/gatherers for most our evolution, but I was of course wasting my breath. Blah blah meat industry advertising marketing scheme you're a sheep consuming products of the evil machine blah blah blah. Sigh.
Meander thall I tend to agree with that, but crazy meat-eater arguments aren't any more ridiculous than the crazy vegetarian arguments. One could argue that learning how to lay down the spear and drive to the grocery store is part of the evolution. And, I'm sure that there's a monogamy argument to be made for societal evolution, though I'm down for the multiple partners thing.
What, you don't have four stomachs too? I don't think I've been to a dairy* farm where they were actively abusing their livestock and dogs, etc. like we're hyped up to believe. I think a lot of well-meaning people have just been misled. The largest farm I've seen was the cleanest and most efficient operation imaginable, with 6000 cows. My uncles have 110 holsteins they are milking at the moment (with many more young ones and calves growing up too) and I suppose they could be cutting corners but no, they're still always trying to improve the health of their cows and the quality of the milk. For example, in the past year they switched to using sand for bedding and that significantly cut down an already acceptable bacteria count. *Nope, didn't grow up on a farm but my parents did and a lot of my family still does or works in agriculture. Took these pics when I visited my grandparents (now uncles') dairy farm in Illinois over the holidays. Spoiler Look at these miserable cows. Do you feel oppressed, Daisy? They even force kittens onto the newborn calves. KITTENS. That kitten in particular cuddles up with all of the newborn calves (that one was 6 hours old there). THE HORROR!
Anybody else seen the Happy People documentary? I'm not really a documentary person but it is my favorite. It follows some hunters and trappers in modern day Siberia. Life is fucking hard there. My favorite person in this documentary was dropped there in his early 20s with no supplies by the commies and told they'd come back with supplies later. They didn't, and he had to make it work. Anyway, this man said something that struck a chord with me. Hunting is better because it is more honest; these animals know not to trust humans, and when they are finally killed, it is simply confirmation that humans are no good for them. Farming (which he did growing up before becoming a trapper), is dishonest. You treat the animals well, they come to you for food, and then one day you put a bullet in their brain. I am not really adamantly anti farming or anything. Some amount of large scale farming is going to have to take place to support the number of people we have on this earth. I do feel that all creatures deserve to be treated with respect. There are a lot of modern practices that make it as humane as possible. Ignorance is bliss, though. I am too poor to buy grass fed Swedish massaged beef and free range poultry. I've got to make due with my reality, and the reality is that I can afford to buy chicken that was probably crammed in a cage.
In the words of Jules Winfield: Exactamundo. The way to respect an animal is to treat it well, feed it well, and slaughter it well. And in my opinion,,,, the most important part,, prepare it and eat it well. When I butcher hogs, or deer, or chickens, I try to use the whole animal and leave as little as possible to waste. That is how you ultimately respect the animal. What is weird to me is that there are individuals out there that are against hunting, and fishing. Its the most free range of all the meats. And specifically here in the U.S. It truly is a animal conservation requirement. Like my father taught me: Catch, and Release, into the Grease.
Vegetarianism is, to me, the height of privilege. At least, to the extent Americans take it. Granted, eating the meat we eat in the quantities we eat it is also quite privileged but...saying "I'm not eating an entire category of foodstuffs because I disagree with it" is pretty special too. I grew up in ranch country. I know families who took money out of the house to make sure the animals were provided for - ranch life is hard, but the animals and their welfare come first. We raised some pigs my dad got in trade for engine work up from piglet to sausage and yeah. Just the three of them? MASSIVE work. I can't imagine an entire operation. Same with the calves we got. I don't like inhumane and disrespectful treatment, but I don't feel guilty for eating meat.
This is the part that gets me. I am open to eating organ meats, cooking whole bone in cuts of meat, saving bacon grease for other uses. The people I know who are all into organic this or that are weird as fuck about their meat. White meat only, chicken breast only, perfect in every way. So needlessly picky and so silly. Reality check, that meat you're eating is muscular tissue of an animal and not in any way "better" or "worse" than something that has a bone in it, or the skin attached, or something that once use to pump the animal's blood. You're eating an animal that used to be alive, but now it is dead and in your mouth. Grow up.
You guys talk about some weird shit in the WDT's. I just came here tout about my new cute haircut and bitching boots I got yesterday. That's it. Move on with your dead meat speak.
Well I just made plans to go to a Mardi Gras ball and dug out an old dress. It fits and looks awesome so I am going to hang out like this for awhile. Maybe this is Tibette thread talk.
Pffffffffft. Just because we aren't talking about tits, ass, killing and/or eating animals? Nah. One Christmas when I was, oh 15-16 I think, I asked for a really nice wool coat. I knew it was under the tree so when I was home alone I unwrapped a few of my gifts until I found it. I wore it that day and wrapped it back up. I did that numerous times until Christmas Eve, when it was legit. It was an awesome coat and made me feel all special when I wore it. And yes, I was a shithead.
Pics of the boots plz. I'm considering going to Annapolis and picking up some of the UGG Sutter boots because cold and wet sucks. And for haircuts - I don't want a cut but I do want to add some blond in and make it look like fire. Because pregnancy.
Jesus fuck, you were a shithead. I don't believe in beating children but if my kid did that and I found out I'd be really tempted to.
Interesting choice of numbers. I don't mind paying money for something I'll wear for years - I've got UGGs that are five years old, and I love them, and they're in excellent condition. I wear them 6 months out of the year, and have no regrets or shame in that. Same goes for jeans. I'll pay for good jeans.
Pics or it didn't happen. What else is there? ETA: Sometimes, you see things in movies, roll your eyes and say, "Oh yeah, like that series of things would actually happen." And, then you read about a Prison bus sliding on an icy road, down an embankment and into a passing train. Now, that, my friends, is a bad day.
As someone who does not hunt, I fully realize hunting is something that needs to be done. Animals like snow geese and deer can be real pests and wolverines alone aren't going to take them down. Deer destroy other crops, not to mention your car if the idiots run out in front of you. Humans are a part of balancing the ecosystem as much as any other predator. Just don't trophy hunt. Best to my knowledge, everyone in this board who hunts fills their freezer with their bounty and that is how it's done. I am not fond whatsoever of trophy hunting or especially the use of traps. It seems less like hunting and more like thrill-killing at that point. It's suprising the percentage of board members on here who hunt. In America, 7% of the population (or less) are registered hunters. That is far less than the percentage on this board.