You know this shit was 4 years ago right? Get the fuck over it. Hey, you need to get off Bill's back Gator. He won 3 Superbowls with no-name WRs and a 6th round draft pick QB. Your jealousy is showing.
I like Belichick. Parcells certainly never won shit without him. I dont like the stupid sweatshirts he wears. The NFL fined Mike Nolan for wearing a suit on the sideline, but Belichick can look homeless for free.
The suit didn't have the shield on it. Anyone else wake-up this morning and realize Mike Wallace still has not officially signed anywhere? Also nothing in the fucking world pisses me off more than the Government getting involved in sports controversy. The Senate getting in on steroids in baseball and now getting in on NFL bounties. The only time the Government should get involved is if Stadiums are becoming drug labs and team charters are moving the drugs themselves. Otherwise they got bigger fish to fry. On the other hand, Dick Durbin is asking the question whether this should be a crime because off the field it would be. I agree with that, but this shit shouldn't take more than a week to hammer out.
Can we also remember that this Spygate controversy happened right before their record breaking 2007 season? You know, the one where they posted the first 16-0 season, and broke many offensive records and made it to the Super Bowl? All while under intense surveillance since the controversy was still fresh in everyone's mind. I can't believe you are still clinging to this overrated incident, years later. Cheating? Yes. Major effect on the games? Obviously not.
The only problem with that theory is that the NFL (just like MLB) is basically a monopoly. Monopolies are illegal, except in these particular cases. Therefore, the government must involve itself from time to time, just to remind them to keep their shit together and to keep them from getting overly corrupt. Right now, the NFL and MLB are making money hand over fist because there is zero competition, and they've grown so large that competition would be impossible. They realize this, just as much as the government does. The Government knows that, if left unchecked, the NFL wouldn't be doing a god damned thing about head injuries and bounties. The only reason that the Rog brought the banhammer down so hard on Payton and Gregg Williams was because the Government was looking over Roger's shoulder and making sure he was following through with his promises (in front of congress) to make the game safer. Without some government oversight, Goodell wouldn't give two shits about bounties, head injuries or anything else, because why SHOULD he give a shit? His league is successful, people love big hits, and as much as it pains me to say it, we are bloodthirsty by nature and seeing people get injured brings in ratings. We may not ENJOY it, per say, but we will certainly WATCH it. Without some government oversight, the monopoly that is the NFL and MLB wouldn't do a god damned thing about Steroids and other performance enhancing drugs and they wouldn't be doing anything about bounties or injuries. In both cases, it is a matter of the government exerting pressure to ensure that the monopolies don't grow too powerful or too corrupt, which is the government's job in this case. The only way to keep the Government out of their business would be to get rid of their anti-trust exemption, which would make the leagues true monopolies, which would make the leagues illegal, and eventually lead to them being broken apart. It would also lead to competition, where players would want to play in the league that was taking measures to keep them safe, and play in the league where cheaters weren't allowed to run rampant. Unfortunately, without competition to force the NFL or MLB to make the game safe for players (i.e. players have no alternative, they MUST play for the NFL or MLB), the government must step in and do that job.
The point they were debating on the radio yesterday was: Is the NFL concerned with the players' safety or its own liability? The NFL worked actively to discredit doctors that attempted to link things like dementia and depression to concussions and head injuries up until just a couple years ago. Then when ex-players started to sue the NFL, suddenly the big fines started getting handed out by Goddell for hits on defenseless receivers, etc.
The NFL is, in the most minimal sense, concerned with player safety. They don't want stars (i.e. Brady, Manning, Rodgers, Brees) injured, because those guys bring in the money, merchandising, and keep their cash flowing. That said, they are sure as shit NOT concerned about Johnny Blocker the special team kid that gets blown up and gets his head knocked off his shoulders during a kick return. That guy isn't selling jerseys, he isn't putting asses in seats, he is just a warm body that can be easily replaced. In a world where the NFL wasn't concerned about injuries, you'd see big fines for hitting Brady or Manning or Brees in the head, while Johnny Blocker can get decapitated on the field with nary a flag. I truly think the NFL doesn't care that much about head injuries. I don't. The only reason they are changing rules and feigning such high concern is because they fear the Government doing to the NFL what Goodell just did to Sean Payton.
What does Superbowl wins have to do with anything vs. other kinds of wins? If knowing the opponent's playbook is what is gaining wins, it doesn't matter if it's a Superbowl or not. That's such a ridiculous comparison, it doesn't even make sense. They posted arguably the greatest season of any football team ever, while under league scrutiny. What does one specific game in the season have to do with anything?
Last time I checked, wasn't the goal of every team to win the Championship? They had a terrific regular season, but they didn't win the Championship. Personally, I think the Spygate thing was overblown, but the fact remains that they have not won a SB since that incident.
D26, good point. I agree with everything you just said. Tebow is the back-up in New York after all the paperwork gets done. Why is Tebow excited about New York? BECAUSE HE THINKS HE CAN BEAT OUT SANCHEZ!
I'ma start banning people who continue this utterly retarded line or argument. Spygate was the commissioner bringing the hammer down on Belichick for thumbing his nose at a small procedural rule change, nothing more.
It was a loophole that the league tried to close. The Pats were definitely not the only team doing taping other teams practices. The hammer was dropped on Belichick for the same reason it was dropped on Payton and the Saints. The NFL told them to stop, they didn't, then they lied about it and then they got caught. Listen to all the interviews from ex NFL players. Every team in the NFL has some type of internal bounty or reward program. They put some $ in a pot and whomever has the best hit or the biggest play that week gets the cash. The difference is that the Saints were caught putting bounties on injuries & knocking people out of games and not just for great plays.
The fact remains that correlation does not equal causation. If you're going to look at what the Patriots have done since 2007 and suggest that the sole reason they've not won a Superbowl is because they aren't videotaping practices, then I seriously don't know what to say. It's just a ridiculous conclusion. Let's see... a team goes 59-21 for 5 seasons, appearing in 2 Superbowls. The team then goes 64-16 for 5 seasons, appearing in 2 Superbowls. Gosh no, that doesn't sound consistent at all. SOMETHING IS CLEARLY AMISS. edit: I don't care about red dots, but if you want to continue the conversation, please do so in a medium that is not sniping at the participants with snarky comments that have no direct method of response. Like, oh, continuing it here where you started talking about it. If you don't think it's a reason, then why are you bringing it up?
Of course it's about liability. Before the rash of suicides and lawsuits by ex-players, the owners and King Roger were trying to shove an 18-game schedule down the players' throats to squeeze another couple billion out of the fans and TV networks. Now they're about to get the shit sued out of them for spending decades ignoring fairly overwhelming evidence? "OH BOY! WE WANT TO KEEP YOU GUYS SAFE OUT THERE!" Nevermind the fact that fining and suspending for big hits does nothing more than protect the star players (read: moneymakers) from career-ending concussions. Most of the guys with brain damage are citing the smaller repeated impacts that they suffered every day. On the surface, it looks nice that Lord Rog is doing anything at all, but it's transparent as hell and at best, completely disingenuous of them to claim they give two shits about player safety when it doesn't impact their wallets. If they really cared, they wouldn't have spent the last few decades ignoring the issue as piles of evidence mounted. In short, Fuck Goodell. I didn't think it was possible to challenge David Stern for the most egomaniacal, self-important, money hungry commissioner in sports, but goddammit he's trying.
I think a major difference between the Saints and other organizations is that the Saints coaching staff completely endorsed and, at times, even contributed to the pot. From what I understand, yes, there are bounties, but coaches are usually smart enough to say stuff like "we didn't know," or to ignore it, to protect the organization.* If players, on their own time, organize bounties, that is one thing. If a defensive coach not only organized the pool, but organized payouts and contributed to the pool himself? While his head coach and his GM covered up for it? That, my friends, is how to fuck an organization in the ass. That really is the bottom line of all of this: other organizations have bounties, but other organizations are better at covering it up and covering their own asses. Sean Payton and Gregg Williams got cocky, and they got the hammer brought down on them in a big, bad way. *Obviously, I am not in any of the other organizations, but I just think that if other organizations' coaches were as brazen about bounties as Williams and Payton were, we'd have heard about it. For the most part, I'm willing to bet most coaches, GMs, and front office types are smart enough to let players do it themselves, while they turn their back on it, to protect the organization. Then they can always plead ignorance of their players' actions.
I wish people would stop blaming Roger Goodell for every perceived shortcoming of the NFL. What the fuck do you think Paul Tagliabue was doing when guys were getting concussed? Or other past commissioners? If you said "not a goddamned thing" you are correct. Everybody associated with the NFL was culpable in ignoring concussion studies. I'm not going to say Goodell is perfect, but at least he's trying. Under Goodell, the NFL has widened its lead as the most popular sport in America, generated billions in revenues, guaranteed 10 years of labor peace, created a pension/disability program for ex-players and increased the NFL's focus on player safety. I think Goodell has done a fairly good job considering what was given to him when Tagliabue retired.
I'm not blaming him for ignoring the same things that past commissioners ignored. I'm calling him a greedy, lying hypocrite for suddenly "making player safety his number one priority" at the same time that he's trying to convince everyone that an 18 game season will have no impact on player injuries and average career lengths, and that it's something that the fans actually want. As opposed to the real reason, which is more money for the owners. You're right. It has grown as a sport and generated billions of dollars. And that still wasn't nearly good enough and he and the owners spent six months holding the season hostage while they forced the players into giving up on virtually every (reasonable, imo) demand they had. The only substantial thing they have to show for it is the disability plan for veterans, and for what some of these guys are going through, it's still pretty lacking. I wouldn't be hanging my hat on that if I were King Rog.
Yeah, especially since we've been discussing that Parcell's was a less effective coach without Belichick. Why isn't Jon Gruden jumping on this opportunity? The team is there, the offense is there, that should be great.