But Seriously...

So was the one at Texas A&M.

 

I'm guessing that's a good thing, considering the amount of animosity TiB members have for that place. "Worst college in America" I believe you guys said not too long ago.

The last thing a campus needs is a pre-September battle royale on their campus. Let's just hope if they do go forward they can be kept in control, because there are lot of sharks sniffing for blood right now.

 

I go there for grad skool so I dunno.

 

I know literally nothing about the school other than college football, and I feel that is certainly enough to judge them as a moral and intellectual wasteland devoid of talent and good sense.

 

I already said my piece about violence towards white supremacists a couple of pages ago so I won't rehash it. However saying protesting is just as bad/useless? When did this happen? Civil rights in the 60's were largely achieved due to protesting: The marches, the sit-ins, the civil disobedience, all that stuff. So what changed between now and then that's rendered protesting ineffective? If the supremacists have a right to demonstrate, people have a right to protest that demonstration. I hate the idea of just 'ignoring' them because it sends the message that what they're saying is ok - after all if no one is pushing back against it their ideas must not be so bad.

 

Here are some things I'd like done surrounding this whole mess (along with other things people have mentioned already) :

Spoiler: This actually IS a long post.

1. Bannon, Gorka, and Miller should be removed from having an official position/influence in the White House. (Ideally Sessions too, but removing an AG that's been confirmed is tougher). This would be something quick and immediate that would be at least a little bit of a balm. It's difficult to take any talk of condemning these groups seriously when you have those people whispering in your ear, helping form policies, and writing speeches.

2. There's been talk of removing any focus on domestic/far-right terrorism from the CVE so that it only focuses on Islamic terrorism, and it's slated to be eliminated altogether in the 2018 budget. Both of those things shouldn't happen, and the funding that was frozen and ultimately revoked from groups working to combat domestic/far-right terrorism from many different angles (and often in addition to Islamic terrorism) should be restored.

3. The Republican politicians who've been condemning the events of this weekend should take action when policy is enacted or legislation is proposed that mirrors white nationalist and white supremacist ideology, rhetoric, and goals even when it's not explicitly brandishing swastikas.

4. These groups, like pretty much all terrorist and extremist groups these days, are radicalized online. I'm not just talking about places like Stormfront, or even 4chan, but there have been plenty of studies tracing the evolution of these groups through and linking individual members to things like Gamergate, redpillers, incels and the like. I don't believe in the concept that our online selves are radically different than who we actually are. I actually think our online selves are the most authentic versions of who we are. I just don't buy that someone who is spending their free time chronically and excessively carrying out harassment campaigns on social media or message boards that are racist, sexist, anti-Semitic, or just regular ol' violent are actually these perfectly great, moral, upstanding citizens that don't pose a threat to anybody in the real world. And I don't buy the idea of an ironic white supremacist who is totes just peppering their entire online personality with swastikas because it's hilarious but then also just happens to believe a bunch of white supremacist or white nationalist shit but is definitely not a white supremacist or white nationalist. If you look like a white supremacist and you quack like a white supremacist, you're a fucking white supremacist. I think having a complete lack of accountability and responsibility for our online activities, or to not make use of the vast amount of information we have to work with on the internet to combat this shit, is a mistake for all threats of terrorism and mass violence. However, what that looks like, I have no idea. I'm not sure if that's at all possible while maintaining certain important rights or altering how the internet functions in some way that has far-reaching consequences that I don't want either. But, I think there are people who are much more qualified to figure that out than I am, and I think those people should be supported. (In fact, one of the anti-terrorism groups that lost its funding was specifically working on targeting online recruitment tactics for terrorists across the board.)

5. This is going to seem way out of left field, but, I think we need to reexamine how law enforcement and our judicial system deals with domestic violence. There is one thing uniting nearly all of the men that have committed mass violence or terrorist attacks in this country - apolitical, Islamic, far-right, and far-left - and that's a history of domestic violence against their girlfriends, wives, mothers, or daughters. Just taking a look at the attacks that have either been carried out or thwarted in the past year, off the top of my head this is true for Charlottesville, the Oklahoma bombing that was stopped this week, the guy who shot the Congressmen, at least one of the guys who were stopped from bombing a mosque in Kansas, and Pulse. (It wasn't the case for the train stabbings in Portland, and I just can't remember any other recent incidents.) I'm pretty sure none of those guys served any time for those cases either. I'm also not sure exactly what this would entail, but it's a strong enough pattern that I think it's worth considering to attack it from the roots up rather than the loftier goals of trying to stop white nationalism or Islamic extremism altogether. (Plus it has the added bonus of taking domestic violence more seriously just in general.)

6. Similarly, a lot of what unites these people all across the ideological spectrum is that they've served in the military (or sometimes, like in the case of Charlottesville, dropped out/were kicked out of the military). It's not as strong of a pattern as domestic violence, but it's still true for the majority of them. I think there needs to be an increase in screening and/or higher qualifications of admittance to ensure that we're not bringing people who already have extremist/radical views or show patterns that they're likely to develop them in the future, and then training them to be killers. Also, examining military training to see if there's something there that's exacerbating these views or even helping to develop them in the first place. Also, increasing resources to help manage those that have had these changes after serving due to PTSD. (Again, just a nice goal in general regardless of whether or not it has links to terrorism and mass violence.)

None of these are a catch-all perfect solution. But I think they'd help, and they're a lot more concrete and achievable then striving for "let's end racism."

 

One of the most important aspects of consuming media intelligently is not just when or of who to be skeptical, but also when and of who to trust. If you just blanket distrust all reporting, you're as easy to manipulate with propaganda as someone who trusts everything they read. Russia has made an art of this form of propaganda: https://www.rand.org/content/dam/rand/pubs/perspectives/PE100/PE198/RAND_PE198.pdf

 

You can't radicalize a well-rounded, educated community member. The first step in this process is isolation, and that's been on the rise since the 1990's. It's simple, but the guys who have spent time outside their comfort zone and are welcomed by another community don't seem to villainize the "other" as easily.

I disagree with the notion that most of these guys are military. I think a healthy chunk of them have military ties, and aspire to it, but it's more of an economic indicator (the military heavily recruits in the areas these guys congregate...rural, not much else going on, no clear career path, etc). From my experience, they were racist shit-heads before joining the military, not because of it.

I think ultimately these guys lack a moral, masculine crusade and latch onto imaginary villains. I remember a gun show in SC that featured some fucking cringe-worthy t-shirt slogans against muslims, and my initial thought was "an American who spends 99% of his life fed, air-conditioned and entertained hates a brown guy that spends 99% of his life starving, sweating and in fear who is across the fucking world and has nothing of value". Again, listen to Alex Jones' rhetoric...he's pining for a crusade, some endeavor to cement the idea of moral superiority. These men were brought up on the notions that have largely eroded: men rule the household, sex is a religious, procreative activity (as opposed to a social, recreative activity), white men sit atop the social food chain thanks to building the system, good ole boy networks, writing the rule book, and the US is never the villain. This is "Fight Club" without critical thinking skills. So, the manufacture the drama themselves. They conjure danger and persecution in the mundane thanks to an active imagination, cognitive bias and selective media diet.

I've told people in SC about Baltimore, and heard responses like "whole damn place needs to be cleaned out". I am astounded by the ignorance: someone who's never left the tri-county area thinks (and says!) that a city they've never visited needs to be wiped out because of a crime problem that's more complex than "the darkies do it, so kill em all and problem solved!". Why would that line of thinking exist? Because: insular, uneducated, angry and a sense of assumed superiority.

The scary part of this for me is the upcoming generation that's been told they are special their entire lives. At some point the math doesn't add up: we can't all be CEO's or NFL cheerleaders, and then what? Who gets blamed? Who gets the ire? It's not mommy's precious snowflake, it's likely some other evil caused Justin to not get that job, or Ayeidyn to win the prize....could affirmative action be to blame? Who ended up winning? A (insert minority here)? What in the world has my America come to?

 

Racists would be easier to ignore if they weren't ingrained into power structures at all levels of the U.S.

Like in 1991, when a judge found that "neo-Nazi, white supremacist gang" of deputies--the Vikings--exists at the Lynwood station with the knowledge of department officials. "Policy makers" in the department, Hatter said, "tacitly authorize deputies' unconstitutional behavior." (LA Times)

Or in late 80s and 90s, when "John Burge initiated a pattern of dehumanizing abuse that would terrorize at least 120 African- American men, their families and the black community for the next twenty years. This pattern was marked not only by its uniquely brutal tactics, but also by its overtly racist motivation. Burge referred to his notorious electric shock device as the “nigger box,” used the term “nigger” as part of his torture routine, and also used the term to describe his victims in boastful conversations with friends and even casual acquaintances." (The Nation)

He was only ever prosecuted in 2008, and only then because he lied.

The next year, in 2009, the Department of Homeland Security conducted a study. Guess what they found?

“Federal law enforcement agencies in general — the FBI, the Marshals, the ATF — are aware that extremists have infiltrated state and local law enforcement agencies and that there are people in law enforcement agencies that may be sympathetic to these groups”

Strom Thurmond got elected for 60 straight years. Steve King continues to get reelected. Even if they disappear, the people that voted for them won't. We're not talking about some kids on 4Chan. We're talking about a structural influence that goes completely in one direction.

If ISIS ran your local police precinct, and then started holding demonstrations, I feel like the response wouldn't be "well, let's just ignore them and see how that works."

Kind of bittersweet that some people are finally "discovering" what uh, some groups have known for a long time.

 

Now imagine if those people were just a few people standing around with torches with absolutely no media coverage? Those pictures wouldn't have been shared, those people wouldn't have been doxxed and they would have continued living their merry little racist lives.

In order for racists in public positions to be removed, we have to have a clear, unambiguous denunciation of specifically white racism. Clear means that we stop dressing it up as "cultural pride." Unambiguous means we don't muddle it with "well both sides did some bad stuff." White means we put avocado on it and then double the price.

 

Is it true that misuse of pronouns in Canada can be a legal offense or even a hate crime? I have heard Jordan Peterson speak quite a bit about the hate speech laws but I don't understand where the actual boundary is.