Adult Content Warning

This community may contain adult content that is not suitable for minors. By closing this dialog box or continuing to navigate this site, you certify that you are 18 years of age and consent to view adult content.

Coronavirus: Miles away from ordinary.

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Juice, Jan 28, 2020.

  1. SouthernIdiot

    SouthernIdiot
    Expand Collapse
    Emotionally Jaded

    Reputation:
    144
    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2017
    Messages:
    2,424
  2. Aetius

    Aetius
    Expand Collapse
    Emotionally Jaded

    Reputation:
    839
    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2009
    Messages:
    9,067
  3. Kubla Kahn

    Kubla Kahn
    Expand Collapse
    Did I just shit myself?

    Reputation:
    730
    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2009
    Messages:
    11,551
  4. Juice

    Juice
    Expand Collapse
    Moderately Gender Fluid

    Reputation:
    1,452
    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2009
    Messages:
    13,970
    Location:
    Boston
    Yeah that was really good. It’s insane that they have had to deal with that situation multiple times a day, every day, for nearly 2 years.
     
  5. downndirty

    downndirty
    Expand Collapse
    Emotionally Jaded

    Reputation:
    501
    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2009
    Messages:
    4,597
    Per official estimates, we will see around 500k cases PER DAY til Mid-January.

    I keep saying it, but our health care system is fragile right now. We no longer have federal medical teams on backup, they are all deployed now.

    Let's hope omicron doesn't give rise to anything worse. I'd wager there will be a variant that hits a particular population harder, say folks living with diabetes or a particular genetic feature.

    With 500k a day, even I am wondering where the fuck are some of the more advanced counter measures. No one is canceling shit, kids in schools, etc.

    From the FEMA National Preparedness Report: "In a National Institutes of Health (NIH) study fo 558 U.S. hospitals from March to August 2020, nearly one in four COVID-19 deaths (23.2%) was potentially attributable to hospitals strained by surging caseloads."

    I interpret this to mean when the cases surge, the quality of care declines. When it declines precipitously, more people die.

    I wonder how that same study would play out now, with the incredible strain placed on these folks, and the stress of the past 22 months, plus the promise of no end in sight. I can't imagine it's a good time for anyone but medical malpractice lawyers right now.
     
    #7325 downndirty, Jan 4, 2022
    Last edited: Jan 4, 2022
  6. Juice

    Juice
    Expand Collapse
    Moderately Gender Fluid

    Reputation:
    1,452
    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2009
    Messages:
    13,970
    Location:
    Boston
    What is your take on Biden saying that the there is no federal response plan for COVID?
     
  7. Aetius

    Aetius
    Expand Collapse
    Emotionally Jaded

    Reputation:
    839
    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2009
    Messages:
    9,067
    They were proven to be political suicide. The American voter has demonstrated an extremely clear preference for more death over more restrictions.
     
  8. Dcc001

    Dcc001
    Expand Collapse
    New Bitch On Top

    Reputation:
    434
    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2009
    Messages:
    4,736
    Location:
    Sarnia, Ontario
    I just saw this now. Are you talking about the Malone interview?

    Canada is locking down. Quebec instituted curfews and counter measures; Ontario just sent all the kids home until January 17th (ha, yeah right). No more dining, gyms, etc.
     
  9. sisterkathlouise

    sisterkathlouise
    Expand Collapse
    Emotionally Jaded

    Reputation:
    188
    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2009
    Messages:
    892
    Don’t worry, most schools will close in the next week or two when they no longer have enough staff to keep going.
     
  10. Aetius

    Aetius
    Expand Collapse
    Emotionally Jaded

    Reputation:
    839
    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2009
    Messages:
    9,067
    Yes
     
  11. Nettdata

    Nettdata
    Expand Collapse
    Mr. Toast

    Reputation:
    3,001
    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2006
    Messages:
    26,654
  12. Dcc001

    Dcc001
    Expand Collapse
    New Bitch On Top

    Reputation:
    434
    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2009
    Messages:
    4,736
    Location:
    Sarnia, Ontario
    Rogan has had three doctors on in a row. McCullough, the first, is apparently the most published doctor in the world when it comes to cardiology and kidney health. One could argue that he's stepped outside of his lane to advocate for review on the current vaccines. He is, however, qualified to commend on the cardiovascular risks (for Covid and the vaccines). Personally, when he kept insisting how qualified he was, and when he spoke in strident absolutes, it raised flags and I could see how some of his statements generate hard (warranted) pushback.

    The second doctor, John Abramson, was ostensibly there to discuss the opioid crisis and pharma's role in it. They touched on Covid once or twice, but a big takeaway from the episode: Pharmaceutical Company X (PCX) develops a vaccine. They design the drug trials, they run the testing themselves (or hire a contractor to do it, who is bound by NDRs and PCX is ultimately responsible for the study regardless of who runs it), produce the data, process the data and then deem the drug suitable for submission to the FDA. The FDA - and any other independent testing agency, including the peer reviewing that is done - are not supplied with the raw data. They are supplied with PCX's interpretation of the data, and the calculations run off the proprietary data. So any peer review that you read, and any approval that the FDA does their due diligence on, has been heavily audited by PCX prior to submission. Additionally, all the pharma companies are responsible for the all the funding for testing, as well as most of the funding for the FDA. Something like 60% of staff at the FDA has or will work for a major pharma company. This incestuous relationship is what allowed opioids to become what they became, and has also laid the groundwork for the other major medical lawsuits of the last several decades. Read into that what you will.

    The last doctor, Malone...I watched the entire episode. I don't know how someone could fault this guy. He absolutely refused any kind of conjecture; he pushed back on Rogan when Joe tried to corner him into answering unanswerables and stuck to pure data whenever possible.

    I mean, you'd have to invest +9 hours to view all the episodes and form your own opinion on what they say. An interesting article here: https://www.sportskeeda.com/mma/new...illions-listeners-tucker-carlson-fox-news-cnn

    Which is, of course, a small sports site so take it with a grain of salt. If this chart...

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    ...is to be believed, it would seem like Rogan has an influence that everyone else is foolish to ignore. Rather than trying to limit Rogan's access and quash posts with podcast snippets, you'd think some of the heavy players would try to go on his show and come off at least as knowledgeable as the skeptics he's had, or put up their own long-form online interviews and at least maybe compete.
     
  13. Aetius

    Aetius
    Expand Collapse
    Emotionally Jaded

    Reputation:
    839
    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2009
    Messages:
    9,067
    Refused any kind of conjecture? He was openly speculating that we were in the midst of a nazi-era-esque mass psychosis. I don't know if he repeated the claim on Rogan, but days earlier he was tweeting that the pfizer vaccine killed more people than it helped. He asserted a wild conspiracy theory that hospitals almost universally across this country were intentionally withholding treatment they knew to work in order to kill people for profit. Just because he speaks softly in a loving-grandpa tone doesn't mean that what he was saying wasn't nuts.
     
  14. Fiveslide

    Fiveslide
    Expand Collapse
    Emotionally Jaded

    Reputation:
    458
    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2009
    Messages:
    2,589
    Now, there's an end in sight! At that rate, every man, woman and child will have been infected within a year.

    They just closed the kid's school down for the rest of the week. They say they're going back on the 10th, but I'll believe it when I see it. This isn't something that will be fixed by closing an extra four days.
     
  15. Dcc001

    Dcc001
    Expand Collapse
    New Bitch On Top

    Reputation:
    434
    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2009
    Messages:
    4,736
    Location:
    Sarnia, Ontario
    1. What has unquestionably arisen out of this whole mess is that if you question the establishment, there will be consequences. It appears that any person in a position of medical authority who even deigns to question the science is censored and/or silenced. I'm not even talking about the nutjobs...I've personally seen the College of Physicians email that went out in Ontario advising all doctors that they would be subject to professional discipline if they administered ivermectin, or even SAID something (privately, to a patient or on social media - all three circumstances were specifically named) that was anything other than insisting upon vaccination. Given that we're at almost 90% vaccinated and the schools just shut down due to skyrocketing cases, I'm going to change the subject.

    With regard to the "hospitals killed people for money," what he was pointing out is that hospitals are incentivized to report Covid cases, because there is a financial kickback of about $3,000 when they do. They treated as per whatever the regulations were at the time so as to be able to code it for insurance purposes, even when there were other drugs that could have been tried as last-ditch efforts to save people. I don't think there are too many individuals out there who let a person with Covid die so that they could greedily pocket the three grand; I do think that if you structure your financials a certain way, you'll get certain behaviour.

    We've had page after page on this board about how almost no one has the intellect or the training to actually understand how the science of vaccines work, or the ability to read complex medical journals and understand what they're saying. This guy has those credentials, and was on the team responsible for the development of RNA vaccines. Here's the guy who has the background we've been talking about, and in his medical opinion the vaccines are causing unintended, harmful side effects. Believe him or don't believe him. Writing him off as a nut without cutting his arguments to pieces is likely not going to have the desired effect.
     
  16. Aetius

    Aetius
    Expand Collapse
    Emotionally Jaded

    Reputation:
    839
    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2009
    Messages:
    9,067
    That's not his medical opinion, that's his political opinion.
     
  17. Dcc001

    Dcc001
    Expand Collapse
    New Bitch On Top

    Reputation:
    434
    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2009
    Messages:
    4,736
    Location:
    Sarnia, Ontario
    No, it's his medical opinion. Politics is deplatforming him for saying it.
     
  18. Aetius

    Aetius
    Expand Collapse
    Emotionally Jaded

    Reputation:
    839
    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2009
    Messages:
    9,067
    If it was a medical opinion it would have been backed by a medical argument. Instead it was backed by a political argument. The argument wasn't "pfizer vaccine is harming people because the data shows no reduction in severity of symptoms or incidence of death, and the mechanism of action causing myocarditis is blah blah blah" it was "pfizer vaccine is harming people because they're owned by BlackRock and Vanguard and the hospitalists have all decided to hide drugs from you because of money."
     
  19. walt

    walt
    Expand Collapse
    Emotionally Jaded

    Reputation:
    465
    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2009
    Messages:
    2,409
    It's been one week since I got a positive home test, and I'm certainly feeling better than last week. However I'm still coughing, and as recently as last night felt short of breath while I was cleaning our kitchen countertop. Taste is sort of muted, smell is wonky. I can smell some things, other things not at all. Which is nice when the dog farts.

    Our county health department is overwhelmed and hasn't contacted me. The hospital that did my PCR test just called to check on me last night and make their recommendations, five days after my results came back.

    Our school district superintendent sent out a message that the state says we can now return to work after five days if we're asymptomatic, wear a mask, and only go to and from work. No stopping at the the store or anything directly home to isolate. I emailed my boss and told him I'm still coughing, I'll be back Monday. So I'm using this remaining isolation time to work on my next book and making good progress.

    But damn I cannot wait until my 10 days is up ( Saturday ) and I can get out of here for a while.
     
  20. downndirty

    downndirty
    Expand Collapse
    Emotionally Jaded

    Reputation:
    501
    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2009
    Messages:
    4,597
    1m cases showing up after the holidays is incredible, awful, but not without logic. 500k a day for 2-3 weeks...fuck me. Conservatively, they are predicting over 6 million cases in two fucking weeks.

    Playing with numbers: 6,000,000 cases. If 2% of those need hospitalization, that's 120,000 people, or the population of Hartford, CT. If the fatality rate is 1%, that's an entire football stadium full of people dead...completely avoidable, preventable and unnecessary. And somewhere there's a tipping point where the fatality rate starts to climb, because the hospitals are overwhelmed....

    The federal government had a pandemic response, dusted off and updated during the Obama years. During the Trump administration, it was weakened, dismantled then ignored.

    The Biden administration inherited a pretty good situation, all things considered: cases going down, vaccines rolling out, most of the unpopulear measures were behind him. Overall, the vaccine rollout didn't go too badly for them. Put differently, when is the last time the federal government gave something away for free to literally everyone, to the tune of billions of doses, and there were no huge lawsuits, scandals, corruption claims, etc? So far, with the vaccine rollout, so good. They simply cannot understand the culture war being waged against them, and refuse to change tactics. Thus the effort is doomed.

    The Biden administration is basically saying "the White House shouldn't be the face of this, the health officials we hired should be. We're going to let the experts, scientists and people with the authority we delegated handle this." And every GOP state governor ignores their suggestions, then comes crying to FEMA for shit.

    They are hamstrung by the information war being waged, and I doubt they will ever truly get a handle on it. What septegenarian understands internet culture well enough to figure out how to neutralize trolling at that level, much less how to fix the media nightmare contributing to this?

    Don't get me wrong, this is far better than the previous administration. They probably are being truthful in saying, "we don't have anything new planned, we've been running the playbook and we're doing the best we can with it." If they trashed the Trump team's plan, then it would further politicize the virus and its countermeasures. And should the Biden team get more involved, it will likely do more harm than good.

    At the enforcement level? I think they could use a firmer hand to get this shit under control. We're missing a congressional hearing about COVID misinformation, and a few cases making a vivid example out of some dickbag profiting from it (cough cough Alex Jones, Joe Rogan, etc.), to drive the point home. Right now, there's no incentive to tell the truth, because it's old, plain and obvious and there's tremendous incentives to lie: clicks, revenue, attention, and if you're crafty enough, an ability to propose your own miracle treatment based on fuck the fuck all. There's no disincentive to lying, you can do it as much as you want!

    Until there's another stadium full of people dead next month, nothing will change. I think that's been the biggest frustration with the Biden administration: not much different.