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Coronavirus: Miles away from ordinary.

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Juice, Jan 28, 2020.

  1. Revengeofthenerds

    Revengeofthenerds
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    just so we're clear here, this isn't a political "orange man bad" thing. That's literally what he was wanting:



    (full clip for context, injecting disinfectant remark comes around 2 min mark)
     
  2. ODEN

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    Cool. Since this is so political to you, tell me your thoughts on the responses, writ large, to his clamping down on travel from China early days? Was that helpful to the Ronaresponse?
     
  3. Evolution

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    We missed a crucial window to start building supply infrastructure. It is possible that even with shutting down flights this would have spread, but if Trump had taken warnings seriously and started getting tests created in January we would have had significantly more and better options on the table. If we were able to test as aggressively as countries like South Korea, we likely could have limited or slowed down spread. We could potentially have tens of thousands less dead at this point. The narrative was also just super fucked up for way too long- people are still saying this is just a flu because of the spin he put on it for political reasons / the economy.
     
  4. Gravy

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    Yes. I think it probably was. It probably could have been even more effective by the sound of it. Trump got lucky that his xenophobia was a smart move.

    And yes, this is all "so political" to me obviously. Not wanting a guy who suggests that cleaning blood with disinfectant will treat the virus is a political position.

    Actually, I take that back. It is a political position. It shouldn't be. But it is. Trump voters made it one.
     
  5. ODEN

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    Mods, my apologies, but I can't help it. If this belongs in the other thread, feel free to move it - Please do explain whatever it is you mean with this. Tell us all how Trump voters made this political?
     
    #1845 ODEN, Apr 23, 2020
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2020
  6. Gravy

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    Trump voters support a guy who suggests injecting people with disinfectant. To say that Trump is dumb as fuck for doing so is now political (As you yourself, called me in your post) because it is wrong to criticize Trump about anything.

    I'm really not sure what you don't understand about that. Either way, I'm tapping out. Have fun.
     
  7. kindalas

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    Instead of rubbing two brain cells together and asking "what the fuck?" to any of the hundred idiotic and dangerous comments Trump has made they doubled down on conspiracy theories and willful ignorance and they continue to attack anyone who dares bring science or facts into the discussion as having some kind of left leaning agenda.

    Because you know wanting competence in leaders is apparently a fringe left wing value.
     
  8. ODEN

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    To e clear, who will these folks be voting for?
     
  9. kindalas

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    Either someone competent or Trump.

    Hence why competence is a left wing value now.
     
  10. downndirty

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    Slow your roll. No one in 2016 saw this coming. Hell, we had more reason to believe in WW3 than this. I don't think it's fair to say that voters thought Trump would fuck up a pandemic, because...we actually have a decent track record for pandemic response. Admit it: of all the things you were worried about him doing, this was low on the list. We thought (knew) he would fuck up foreign policy, the economy, and make a general shit show out of things. No one thought this motherfucker would have 50,000 corpses due to a virus.

    The people that DID guess that, the ones that work for HHS and CDC....they did their jobs in predicting it, preparing for it, detecting it, studying, and warning him about it. He failed to do his and act on it.

    Trump's response failure has been so consistent you could pick just about any date in 2020 and see something that he either didn't do, failed to do well, advice he ignored, or something he did do that was detrimental to the effort.

    The nationwide shutdown wasn't necessary in December. We HAD a containment window, and at Trump's direction, we blew it. That is his fault. When that containment window opened and closed is up for debate, but I promise you it was not 2 months after infections were detected. If you think the president of the United States calling it a hoax, saying it was under control, touting unverified cures, and the list of other things he's done in this response is defensible, I'd love to hear it....about 30 minutes after my edibles kick in. It's not. His "how did Trump handle COVID-19" approval rating needs to be fucking zero.

    Is Trump alone in this? No. The head of the CDC, Secretary Azar, and several other senior officials failed to do at least part of their jobs, which is convince Trump to do the right thing. And the folks who politicized this, red or blue, need to be punished for that. But the ultimate responsibility rests with Trump.

    Not to get into the philosophy of "wrong', but there are two categories of his fuck-ups. One, the things he didn't do, but could have, which cost us precious time, diminished the support we needed, and crippled our response. Two, the things he did do, but shouldn't have, like calling it a hoax, installing Pence and Kushner in response orgs, etc. So, by omission or by dishonesty or corruption, he made this worse. This is objective fucking reality, and the sooner we all acknowledge this, the better.

    I know, I know, "the media/liberals", "Teflon Don", etc. That's all well and good, but there are 50,000 corpses right now, that didn't have to die. Those aren't soldiers that signed up for some risk. Those are civilians, that deserved better.

    We deserved better.

    When I get deployed to the field, it's awful. You're surrounded by destruction, suffering, and quite often the worst bits of humanity. It's emotionally wrenching, and you never get used to it. The only thing that lets me sleep at night is that when I go, I leave it all on the field. When I accept my deployment orders, I simply agree to do everything within my power to help ease the suffering. I sit here comfortable saying that "I did everything I could to prevent loss of life, suffering and loss of property." That's not remarkable: that is the expectation. That is the standard. That is the minimum. That's what we are all held to.

    Trump cannot make the same claim, and he needs to be held accountable for that. His supporters need to be saying "do better", instead of defending his mistakes.
     
  11. Kubla Kahn

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    Did I just shit myself?

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  12. ODEN

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    Trump or......

    Biden? Biden the Competent. Surely you must mean Biden the Competent. Don't be bashful, say it.

     
  13. downndirty

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    Biden is a former VP, compared to the reality tv show host that just suggested you eat Tide pods to cure a pandemic he's responsible for.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Biden

    Trump literally cannot operate a charity in his home state, after stealing $2m from a children's cancer charity. He stole from kids. Kids with cancer. He's crashed the economy, caused thousands of Americans to die, fleeced the American taxpayer, and might as well be called "Shit Midas" because everything he seems to touch goes from gold to turd. He literally lost money running a casino. He used campaign funds to pay off a porn star he fucked. He was impeached. He's golfed more than any other president, racking up hundreds of millions of dollars of bills...paid to his own resorts, which he refused to put in escrow, literally violating the emoluments clause. His career in public service began by shitposting on Twitter about Obama.

    By what measure does this person deserve to be re-elected?

    Biden is sort of goofy and....? Doesn't speak well? Is old?

    Yeah, I see how this is a hard choice. That's some good thinkin', there Vern.
     
  14. Kubla Kahn

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    How you can say that with a straight face blows my mind given the entire world has ground to a halt and every country is in the same boat of trying to keep their economies from being completely moribund. Trump will answer for his handling of the pandemic come November.
     
  15. walt

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    Discussion of the administration's response is fair game, but let's not let it veer too far off topic beyond that.
     
  16. Juice

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    What he^ said. We have a thread if you want to bitch about Trump or Biden and the election. This isn’t the 2.0 version of it.
     
  17. Kampf Trinker

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    Yeah, the pretending this is uniquely affecting the US is getting really tiresome. Especially considering many countries in Europe have 3x the death rate relative to population we do.
     
  18. downndirty

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    The virus isn't unique. The impact is unique to the US.

    Or am I somehow misinterpreting we have 25% of the world's fatalities with about 3% of the population?

    Are other countries reporting record unemployment (26 million)? Do their unemployment numbers also implicate millions of uninsured that now face financial barriers to healthcare?

    Did other world leaders call this a fucking hoax, and tout untested cures, like it's an episode of the fucking Joe Rogan podcast? No one else seemed to waste the time we did, and yes, that time wasted made the impact far worse. Imagine where we would be if we started taking this seriously in January, as opposed to March. The economic impact

    How about the $2 trillion (soon to be $2.6 trillion) in spending amounting to corporate bailouts? Other countries refuse to provide stimulus to companies registered in tax havens, or place heavy restrictions on the type of companies that can get access to funds. How are we handling that? Did the benefits of that accrue to the average person suffering from the economic distress, or did it go to fucking billionaires: https://inequality.org/great-divide/billionaire-bonanza-2020/

    This is worse than it needed to be, and yes that includes the economy and yes, that is Trump's fault.

    If Trump can claim credit for the stock market highs, he has to accept blame for the lows.
     
  19. Juice

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    That’s just not true whatsoever. Only about 25% went to larger corporations, and that was used to bailout the airline industry. The website your citing is run by someone strongly affiliated with the AFL-CIO, so maybe consider an inherent bias there. The conditions on which the airlines received bailout money is debatable, but saying the stimulus was just for the corporations is nonsense.
     
  20. Kampf Trinker

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    No, it isn't unique DND. Look at the death rates in Europe. Many are far higher than the US. It's ridiculous to only look at totals when comparing countries with 1/10 or 1/5 the population.

    And yes, their economies are suffering as well, or are we only counting 'total' unemployed as well?

    Are we the best testing country since we have the most total?