I, for one, hope the Democratic party continues their noble, country above party, fall on the sword, martyrdom of going after Trump. When the next election cycle comes around they will be able to tell their constituents "We fought Trump." That will play well to their rabid base. The rest of their constituents will wonder why they didn't do anything about jobs, the economy, infrastructure, or affordable housing. You know, things people care about.
Yes, Juice. I just awoke. But go back and look at what I said originally. I wasn't making a claim that is how democrats acted in the past. You're the one who brought that into this. No. It doesn't. You're the one who decided to go ahead and put that in the thread with your "if only they did that when it mattered." You/the board in general just like to shit on the democratic leadership as much as possible and it's tiresome because it's done so with the basic idea of being angry at the Dems for being at fault for Trump sitting in the oval. Even now you're shitting on them when you agree, I presume, with their basic position that Pence would be better than Trump. That doesn't make a whole lot of sense.
Historical context of how the leadership has acted in the immediate past is a valid indicator of their current and future motivations and behavior. The leadership is not going to suddenly adopt altruism just because their version of a nightmare scenario has occurred. Harry Reid just happened to retire, Wasserman-Schultz was fired (but not really) because of previously stated reasons, and Nancy Pelosi is successfully fighting off challenges to her leadership. They had all the time in the world to care about the "people," you'll have to forgive us cynics who think it stinks of opportunism.
"We fought Trump...from enacting Medicaid cuts" "We fought Trump...from giving a tax cut to the wealthy while cutting funding to services you need." Those sound like terrible arguments. Also, ToyToy, Republicans control the House, the Senate, and the Whitehouse. And yet, they don't have major legislative achievements to speak of. Who is responsible for not getting anything done?
I'm not saying you build a shrine and sacrifice fifty goats to the democrat gods. I'm saying give them half an ounce of credit for holding the same position you do. And if you want to complain about politicians not caring for the "people" and being opportunists, well, I await your treatise on the Republican party's support of Trump.
The Democrats seem to be the party of bad ideas: imperfect solutions that don't go far enough, because the country has lurched so far to the right anything the government does results in cries of tyranny. These are people who understand we need government and must make sacrifices for the whole of society to work. The Republicans are the party of no ideas: they can't obstruct or oppose anymore, but things like repealing a semi-successful measure like the ACA would result in them getting crucified (millions being kicked off of health care and furthering the skyrocketing costs). At a certain level, the Republicans are the victims of their own rhetoric: what the fuck does an elected official do when they ran on the premise that government is evil? The Republican fetish for individual liberty and the ability to completely take care of oneself without shared social needs/responsibilities works great for a Koch-sucker, but their average supporter has ZERO chance of actually living their lives without regulation and government support and are deluded into believing otherwise. The reddest of the red states receive more federal dollars than they provide. They literally can't achieve their agenda without causing their constituents measurable harm by cutting off the social support network that increasingly millions of people depend on. Again, qui bono: funny how regulations, labor rights and accountability/liability are all things that the Republicans and business community commonly want to dissolve, isn't it? The difference is the Republican base is shrinking: the old, the hyper-religious, and the rural are all demographics that are in decline. The Democratic base is growing, but it's centered around urban areas that often fail to carry swing states. My serious question: Is the typical Republican bullshit failing? Are people seeing the trickle-down economics policy for the fallacy it has been since 1980? I keep harping on this, because both parties are either blind to it or too handicapped by donors to address it: Labor. Labor transcends damn near every issue on both sides and the side that panders to it better wins.
I wouldn't be surprised if Pence has dirty hands when all this shakes out too. He was part of that campaign. Willful ignorance and all that. I'm not banking on it, but I wouldn't be surprised to see him resign once trump inevitably does. Who's up if that's the case. Paul Ryan?
He's definitely dirty, but as a seasoned politician I doubt he allowed himself to be as provably involved as these other chucklefucks did. Line of succession goes: President(Trump), Vice President(Pence), Speaker of the House(Ryan), President pro Tempore of the Senate(Hatch), Secretary of State(Tillerson), Secretary of the Treasury(Mnuchin), Secretary of Defense(Mattis), Attorney General(Sessions), and then Interior, Agriculture, Commerce, Labor, HHS, HUD, Transportation, Energy, Education, VA, Homeland Security. If any person in this chain is ineligible for the presidency (such as not being a natural born citizen) then it simply skips them and goes to the next. In any event we won't get past Hatch, as even in the worst case scenarios I've heard rumored (in which Ryan/McConnell are involved in shady money laundering from Russian sources) Hatch's name never comes up.
No way... he's a Christian first, Republican second, and he's in a position of authority to help "save" the masses, so no way does he bail.
I've excoriated them plenty, but its not the same situation. The Democrats bent over backwards and screwed over their own party to nominate Hillary. The Republican establishment was dragged kicking and screaming into getting behind Trump. The criticism lies in their lack of backbone, not their opportunism of picking a wild card.
I agree. Right now the Dems seem to be doing "the right thing" because that's the most effective spin they have right now to get a win. Even a broken clock is right twice a day, and it's not because it's working... it just looks like it is. It's just more of the bullshit posturing that makes me want to hate almost all politicians. Like Sherman's introduction of the impeachment bill... total grandstanding, going against the wishes of his party to hold off until something substantial comes along so it will be effective. He's just doing it for his own political gain, to appear like he's "doing something".
Hey, I'm saying I think Democratic leadership is doing a bang up job. #Resist, #Not MyPresdent, #ImpeachDrumf I think they should definitely stay the course.
Yup. He's delusional on the Jesus Freak-insane level, where as Trump's is more along the line of clueless, solipsistic ignorance. Pence believes in magic and miracles and thinks power will let him wield those things.
ToyToy, this snark post is worth two squirts of duck shit and somehow it still manages to be the most valuable thing you've ever posted in this thread. Congrats.
Copied from Reddit: The Trump Jr emails reveal that “documents and information” were almost certainly delivered to Trump at the June 9th "meeting". There is no other logical conclusion from the email chain. Fact-1. The initial email states it is being sent at the request of Aras Agalarov. Fact-2. Aras Agalarov is a Russian billionaire with close ties to Vladimir Putin. He was also Donald Trump’s business partner in 2013. Fact-3. The email states Agalarov had become aware of “documents and information that would incriminate Hillary” and which would be delivered to Trump. Fact-4. The email reveals Trump Jr called and spoke with Agalarov's son to verify the email before proceeding. There are only two possibilities: (i) Aras Agalarov wasted Jr’s time and the promised documents were never delivered. (ii) The documents were delivered as promised. Trump's tweets the next week suggest said intel was delivered. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aras_Agalarov Dude....shit's on fire.
Just a reminder to everyone to keep things civil around here, and don't devolve into the "fuck you" "no fuck you" that represents current politics. When this thread was first started I was quite pessimistic about it having a life, and I must say that I've been pleasantly surprised that it has done as well as it has. A large part of that is because much of the discussion has been on information, not on flinging each others' shit at each other. Let's try and keep it that way. If you're going to talk shit, at least do it in a good-natured manner, and take it in the same way that it was intended. If someone oversteps, don't engage, and don't feed the trolls. Murky Buckets.