Bullshit. Pure and simple bullshit. Both sides do it. Look at the black vote. It's a predictable 95-98% Democrat.
I voted for him for the pure and simple reason that I couldn't take another 4 years of the continuing bullshit. I wasn't going to vote at all until I saw all the riots where idiots were bloodying people that simply wanted to hear what he had to say. They were calling him Hitler and a Nazi and then employing the exact tactics that Hitler and the Nazis did to silence anyone who disagreed with them. I did not want those people in charge of my country. I saw no real choice, vote for a God damned idiot or vote for the candidate that the mob wanted. It was lose/lose. This is where we need to fix shit. We need to be given a real choice. The DNC has moved so far to the left I can't deal with their shit. The GOP hasn't moved much, but everyone is digging in their heels like they're rooting for their favorite sports team. Enough of that shit. Enough of the alarmist rhetoric from both sides.
I think the last part is a very solid statement. I agree with it. But I'm curious how you justify the protests, riots, whatever, with a president who literally advocates sexually assaulting women. Someone who has actively encouraged hate toward minorities. His mere presence as our president encourages white supremacists and hate groups. Voting for the latter to spite the former seems kind of counter productive, no?
If they actually go to the polls at all. Yes they might be a reliable democrat vote. But they historically vote in smaller numbers. For many reasons. Black are the reason Doug Jones won in Alabama. That and Roy Moore is a kid fucker. But if it wasn’t for black people going to the polls, he wouldn’t not have won.
How has he actively encouraged hate towards minorities? He refused to join a country club in Florida until they allowed blacks to join. He said Mexico is not sending us their finest as far as illegal immigrants, which is true. If they were Rhodes scholars they would be let in with open arms and not have to sneak in. As far as the sexual stuff and how I could vote for someone that did that....how could you vote for a woman that attacked and tried to ruin every woman that claimed her husband sexually assaulted them? That's just fucking evil. I do agree that the lunatic fringe of racists have embraced Trump and that's a problem, but at the same time, they were always there. They're just more reported on the news now. I grew up with those assholes running around the mountains and they annoyed the shit out of me then. I wish they'd just die off like I'm sure many on the left wish ANTIFA would just go away.
Basically what I'm trying to get at is this: Both sides put up deeply flawed candidates. Why can't we have a candidate that says that? A candidate not aligned with either party. This partisan crap, pointing fingers, name calling, and all the other crap is not solving anything, it's just making it worse.
Are you saying that pointing out that Roy Moore fucked actual kids is partisan bickering? Or were you referring to a different part of my post? I think we need to fix how we all speak to each other about politics. But I also think that leadership from the top needs to provide a good example. Poor leadership in any industry will have similar downstream effects. For example, you have a president who egregiously abuses tax payer money for his own benefit, spending 30% of his time in office so far golfing and making money off his power in office. Is it any surprise to see all these people in his cabinet engaging in similar forms of financial misuse? Ben Carson, Mnuchin, Priuitt? I’m not saying they are the first to do this nor will they be the last. But the culture of this behavior comes straight from the top. Shitty bosses produce shitty results. People may not have liked much about Obama’s politics but you can’t deny he was a good role model for how someone might be a decent person.
I was simply pointing out that I think we need to quit pointing fingers at one another and work together to fix what is horribly broken on both sides.
This political nihilism is, somewhat counterintuitively, a deliberate strategy. It is used to great effect in Russian internal politics, and it is obviously making inroads here in the United States and presumably elsewhere. The strategy goes like this: Convince the public that all politics and all government is fundamentally corrupt and/or compromised (despite the fact that they are not). Push the notion that things can't get any worse (despite the fact that they quite clearly can). If you succeed at 1 and 2, then by definition your candidate cannot be any worse than their candidate (despite the fact that he clearly is), because both your candidate and their candidate reside at rock bottom, by definition. You have now succeeded in preempting any criticism of your candidate because: "He can't be any worse than what we have now." "They're all corrupt anyway." You can now push a candidate with minimal positives and massive negatives past a candidate with minimal positives but minimal negatives. As a voting citizen, it is incredibly important to remember that It can get worse All candidates are not the same Nihilism, unlike national socialism, is not an ethos.
See? At least we agree on that point. I also think we need to stop with the hysterical rhetoric. Roy Moore was accused of hitting on young girls 40 years ago. Yes, that's wrong. But you put up this: That's not helping matters when you post inflammatory claims with no basis in fact. It's possible that I missed some news story that told about him banging a minor, and if I did please post a link.
Perfect. Even the people that voted for Trump are saying he's an idiot and you post something proving their point. That's not helping the conversation or working towards fixing the problem of why this idiot is our president.
Straight from your link: "Of the four women, the youngest at the time was Corfman, who is the only one who says she had sexual contact with Moore that went beyond kissing. She says they did not have intercourse." No matter how wrong/fucked up it was, he didn't fuck a child. So what was your point in posting the link?
Whoops my bad. I thought they actually had sex. This is an absolutely hilarious hill for you to die on though. Carry on.
You know what Gravy? I kind of like you. We actually share a common history of living in OK, I lived on the east side of the state and I gather you live on the west side towards the panhandle. I can vouch that living in Oklahoma can make someone unpleasant and argumentative. I was grouchy as hell when I lived there. I look forward to the day that you reply to one of my posts with relevant content and not a simple snarky comment. I like to think you're smarter then just snark, then again I've been wrong before.
I agree with you on that. But you can't say that in one sentence and then say that Trump is doing anything but attempting to increase the partisanship and divisiveness. My politics lean "left" but I get more almost as frustrated with the stupidity and grandstanding from democrats because I really think if they just played it straight and actually took the high road they would be in a much better position. But, let's look at the budget bill passed today. What's being reported is they offered up about $20 billion in funding for his dumbass wall in exchange for establishing a path to citizenship for people living in the US under DACA provisions. That was rejected and basically in order to pass a budget bill money was reduced for the wall/border security and DACA was kicked down the road again. Our fearless leader comes out with "I am considering a VETO of the Omnibus Spending Bill based on the fact that the 800,000 plus DACA recipients have been totally abandoned by the Democrats (not even mentioned in Bill) and the BORDER WALL, which is desperately needed for our National Defense, is not fully funded." and "DACA was abandoned by the Democrats. Very unfair to them! Would have been tied to desperately needed Wall" What is that doing other than playing to his base and trying to blame the other side for everything? He's basically said the only way to do anything about what the democrats want is to fully fund a wall that will cost in excess of $60 billion and then when the other side says no he goes screaming that democrats don't aren't supporting their base. His ability to not take a single ounce of blame for anything would be remarkable if it wasn't also destructive. Do I think his presidency has brought to the forefront some major issues with our political system? Yes Do I think he has any intention of doing anything to improve that? No
Oh believe me, I know you’ve been wrong before. You don’t look forward to the day I reply to your posts with more than snark. You’re not here to meaningfully engage or learn anything. You’re here to rant and have your opinions validated. That’s all. Besides, there was a time that I did reply with relevant content to you regularly, but you just ignored it. Furthermore, your posts these days don’t merit anything more than snark. From reading your last few posts, if I started poking and prodding it would come down to this: you think everyone should think more like you because you think you’re right. There’s nothing wrong with that. That’s basically the way everyone thinks. Myself included about a lot of things. But you just layer it with bullshit. “I think we should just fix both parties and use common sense—and by that I mean do what I think is right and what is right is all of these right wing positions.” “We need to stop being so partisan—-and by that I mean that everyone should lay off Trump but I’m going to think the DNC are corrupt overlords who are all evil plain and simple and I will never vote for the them because they are all too far left for me even if they weren’t corrupt." You do this while fervently maintaining that Republicans are just as broken as Democrats, but you’re either being dishonest and don’t really think that, or you are just engaging in the political nihilism which Aeitius did an excellent job of outlining above. My money is on the nihilism and that you're just trying to provide an excuse for voting the way you really want despite knowing that how you really feel is/would be condemned by society as odious. You also don’t seem to think deeply about any of this stuff. You’re bitching about 98% of Black people voting for democratic candidates, but you seem to have never once in your life tried to figure out why that might be. If pressed, you would probably vomit out some republican or Trump lines about Dems not doing anything for them or say, "Chicago!" and be oh so proud of yourself for owning the libs again. You can’t figure out why Trump using emails phished by Russian agents as campaign material is not a good thing for the country because "ermergerd the DNC is corrupt!" Your views lack anything resembling depth, nuance, and the critical thinking required to have meaningful conversations here. Trying to engage about any of this with you is like trying to eat soup with a fork. This isn't to say that I expect you to just bow down and repeat the word of thy Lord God Gravy. I leave a lot of this thread alone because even though I disagree, people are probably coming by their positions honestly and have done enough mental work to support those positions. You're just in here to post your rants, complain about the libs, and seek absolution for your shit. I'm generally in here to poke fun at you being a dumbass. I won't say I'm a great addition to the thread, but I will say that your posts are pretty foul for anything resembling a worthwhile discussion. Go back and read Nettdata's message to you a few days ago. I know you're not going to take anything I say seriously. But you should listen to him. I'm sure this post is going to come off as snarky and condescending. And that's because it is. This probably isn't the least bit persuasive in getting you to change what you're doing, but it is honest. Sometimes a spade needs to be called a spade. Even if you wanted relevant content, the old line about not having enough time or crayons comes to mind. Have a good weekend.