This is nonsense, and as smart as he is, Robert Reich says pretty stupid shit sometimes. The airline industry employs about 3/4 of a million people, and entire regions of the country are dependent on consumer travel and commercial shipping. This also doesn’t count the secondary industries that are reliant on them. There is no alternative to the airline industry. So sure, add restrictions to what the money can be used for (loans instead of grants, no bonus comp, etc.), but a collapse of that industry would be a catastrophe.
But that info is not wrong... they took a ton of the bailout money to buy back their stocks and shore up their internal ownership. If government funds are being used to prop up the company, then why should not the government get something in return, like partial ownership?
Isn't this exactly what a structured bankruptcy is for? Let the current owners go broke and bring in new owners that can properly capitalize the industry. The shareholders have enriched themselves off bailouts for a decade, let the shareholders take the bath. It's not like the planes and employees are going to vanish into thin air if the owners lose all their money and then new owners come in.
I have little sympathy for rich fucks who run their business into the ground and then want a hand out, but acting like a global pandemic is not an exceptional circumstance is beyond ridiculous.
Yes, they did. So how about getting all uppity during ANY other bailout that isn't caused by a global pandemic? The democrats have had an enternity to give a shit. Now they're acting like they do just to wave a piece of meat in front of their stupid base. Between this and Biden now being investigated, I swear to fucking god, if you want to blow an election you know who to call.
Dude... I'm not Democrat... and I do get pissed at it whenever it happens... stop thinking that I'm just shitting on it because it's some Republican thing... IN THIS CASE, all by itself, it's a shitty fucking thing that should not be passed, in my opinion. Period. That's my point.
Well that's socialism. We can't have the government owning stakes in companies, can we? Republicans have long shown they don't give a shit about people once they've been born, so they don't get to play the humanitarian card just because a trough of taxpayer money is being made available. You mean like one caused by Republican deregulation of financial markets? That one? As I recall, the only reason that bailout got passed in the first place was due to a Democratic supermajority. And as I recall, most of that bailout was paid back with interest. Based on track records, I'd much rather have Democrats putting together an economy saving bailout than the assholes in charge now.
Not only are we headed for a peak of the crisis in terms of the virus, we're headed for the peak of the crisis politically as well. It's becoming clear that Trump is extremely agitated by the effect the virus, and the measures to contain it, are having on the economy, and he will, in very short order, start trying to work against containment measures in an effort to restore economic activity. This is going to make things worse on pretty much all fronts.
What bailout money is he referring to exactly (serious question)? If i remember correctly, the airline industry at large has not received a bailout since right after 9/11. After that, what difference does it make what they use their cash flow for and what relevance does that have to not letting the industry collapse? Again, Im fine attaching a ton of strings to the money that it has to go into capital and infrastructure and not comp. The US hasnt had a national, flag-carrier airline since around WW2 (Pan Am, I believe) and commerced boomed after it was de-regulated. Agreed in principle and it depends on the type of bankruptcy. But the problem with that approach is that the industry is arguably an oligopoly with enormous barriers to entry and capital requirements. The "new owners" would need to have hundreds of millions just to get started. There arent a ton of investors willing to accept that up-front risk.
That's what I fear. He keeps talking about the economy and the "chinese" virus, shades of Hispanics being "drug dealers and rapist." He's becoming very agitated, to say the least. I wouldn't put it past him at all to take some type of military action against a place like Iran under the guise of striking while they're weakest or some shit, when really he's trying to take eyes off how bad he's doing on the home front. If it weren't for everyone being so caught up in COVID-19, and rightfully so, I'd expect him to face another impeachment before he gets beat next election.
I don't think he'll do anything like that, but expect a ramp up in "the cure can't be worse than the disease" rhetoric over the next week or two, accompanied by comforting lies about how well the situation is being handled, as well as a lack of any federal restrictions similar to what states have implemented.
Are you really asking why the relevance of an industry bailout has anything to do with a company's executives making bad decisions?
Are you really balancing a global industry's impact on the world economy against a single (which?) company's executives? When an economic black swan event occurs, whether or not the company should have had capital reserves, business continuity plans, etc. are up for debate and the consideration of which can be baked into the terms of a bailout, and its why I suggested a loan is better than a grant and executive comp be restricted. The last time this happened, there was no airline industry. Sure, we can just the entire sector crater and wait another 5-10 years for a new one to spin up just based on principle, or we can negotiate thoughtful terms so the bailouts cant be abused and collect interest on those loans.
For one, both Obama AND Bush did bailouts. Specifically the Obama bailouts like those in the auto industry were not fully paid back. Anyway, the longer the dems drag this out the more it will hurt them. That is really, really obvious to anyone who isn't blindly on a 'team'. Even CNN is acknowledging mounting pressure. I will be shocked if this drags out more than a few days, and frankly it really shouldn't.
No, I'm not. I meant all these airlines. And every single one of them does everything they can to screw the very passengers that are forced to use their services. It took a pandemic for these bloodsuckers to waive fees associated with changing or canceling flights. First of all, I cannot believe we've come so far that business continuity plans and capital reserves are bars that apparently some of these companies are either unwilling or unable to meet. Second, these big companies shouldn't be able to ask for government handouts because they make bad decisions. All that does is incentivize them to act recklessly. If some guy gambles away everything, it isn't on the government to bail him out for those shitty decisions. Even if we were going to give them loans with conditions, (a fucking impossibility with this shambles of an administration) there is absolutely no reason for these companies to clean up their act.
You are completely correct on all of this. I don’t want to reward negligent corporate behavior any more that you do. But realistically, there’s a point where sacrificing industries could have a materially significant economic impact on a global scale for a decade or more. Unfortunately, I think we are there right now. Hell, one of the conditions can be that in the most severe cases, the company boards have to turn-over the entire C-Suite for all I care. The point is to plug the hole in the boat as quickly as possible, not decide who gets to stay onboard while it continues to take on water.
If that kind of correction is required for the government to implement the necessary fixes to prevent corporate malfeasance, then I am prepared to make that sacrifice so the generations after mine have the opportunity to live in a world where climate change is under control, bubbles stop happening in our economy, and tax dollars don't go toward some asshole's yacht.
Well it’s not to stop malfeasance, it’s to substitute for a sudden and unexpected drop in consumer demand across all carriers all at once. But I understand your point, just disagree on the larger outcome (respectfully).
Which is a very fine idea in the long run, I just don't think this exact moment is necessarily the best time to draw up the plans on all this. We do have a pressing matter already at hand and all.
Yep, the democrat leadership has been just fucking stellar the whole way. Just like always. Shit, I don't always agree with Huffpo, but he's not wrong. Call me crazy, but finding yourself to the right of the likes of Donald Trump and Mitt Romney in the middle of crisis is not the democratic leadership reflecting their constituent's values. Yes, it's not just uber republicans taking issue with their bullshit. If it was just the lack of provision over one piece of the bill - ok, take a moment and sort that out, but if you look at what the democrat leaders are saying, they are taking snipes at fucking everything. If you are going to do this shit right now you should at least have your own ready.