To draw a distinction, without knowing what branch your relative served in, Sunni and Shia insurgents or Taleban were most likely far greater threats to their life in their 3 tours then OBL and his boys. The winner in this with respect to day to day security are moderate Arabs, I suspect their will be minimal short term* benefits to serving troops. * Long term hopefully this will get the Taleban to the negotiating table.
A few weeks ago another soldier in my troop was in deep shit for posting a video to facebook of paratroopers jumping while he was on the dropzone. Within a few days of him posting it Division, Brigade, Squadron, and Troop were all aware of it and he barely kept his rank/security clearance. If this conversation is legit that Ranger is likely standing in front of his chain of command explaining why he should keep his rank/security clearance/stay in Batt, and likely explaining it to someone higher than the First Sergeant. FOCUS: Heard on the news today they are now speculating as to why OBL was shot and not taken alive. As in Wolf Blitzer was all but calling for an investigation into the SEALS use of deadly force. The picture he painted was the SEALS could have easily waltzed into the compound and walked right out the front door to an awaiting air mobile escort. Unreal.
I support the decision to ice him there and then; however I absolutely believe the motivating factor was political/strategical and not operational.
Off topic for a minute: if it's not an automatic loss of clearance when you pull shit like this, how hard is it to be approved in the first place? How much of a fuck-up can you be and still get TS clearance?
It's pretty easy for some 4-foot-tall chump in an expensive suit thousands of miles away to paint whatever pictures he feels like for the sake of stirring the pot. I know, I know, give him credit. Every 12 months or so he goes overseas and pops up on camera from time to time with his finger in his ear wearing one of those poseur multi-pocketed vests to show how "rugged" he is while "out in the shit". This was well thought, well planned, well executed. Not one American was hurt (right?), and aside from the little technical glitch involving trying to push an airbourne helicopter into the driveway with the motor turned off you wouldn't wake Dad and hitting the garbage cans, ths could not have turned out better. What would they have got out of taking him alive? Cooperation from the man that hates them the most? Do it the Soviet way: when they have some murderous piece of shit deemed criminally inhuman (like Andrei Chikatilo) they take him into the basement shower room, point behind them and say "What the hell is THAT!!?!?" And put a bullet behind their ear. These guys are the elite of the elite who follow orders. For Christ's sake, Charlie Sheen starred in a movie made in their honour. If these guys used deadly force, there is no other answer than it was necessary. Good riddance.
He probably had to get collateral secret clearance. Like any background check it is slightly limited in it is your background, sadly this does not preclude you from being a fucking moron in your future. If that conversation was true that dude is fucked.
To echo Toddus, they can't prevent future fuck-ups and screen out 100% of morons. However, the people who usually have the very high level access to Super Secret Squirrel Information™ (like stuff involving DEVGRU, CAG, or any other JSOC SMU) are smart enough not to run their mouth.
How about his submission to the Body for Life challenge??? Heard he won 100 pounds of baby back ribs.
It's tough. When I got mine back in '91 (and I was only TS-2 (SBI), not TS-1) they still called former employers, friends, neighbors, etc. Granted, I was 21 when I went in, so had a background they could check a little more thoroughly. They didn't do on site visits, hell, I was a generator mechanic, not like I was S2 or anything. But I was amazed that the people they got into contact with. Right now, the son of my parent's neighbors is in the Air Force in training to be an interpreter (Arabic, imagine that), and myself, my mother, my stepfather, my nephew (his age, friend of his), have been interviewed IN PERSON. Yep, they ask if they can meet you at home or work and what is a good time... How's that for fun... uh, I have lunch from 12-12:30, show up then. They show up, flashing a badge, and you get to find a closed place to talk to them. 20 years ago, it took me about 9 months (they started when I was in basic) to get *just* TS-2 clearance. And that was way before the internet, texting, overseas cell phones, etc. "Jake", as we'll call the AF dude, has been in for over six months, and only the past month or so have we been contacted & interviewed. If they go to the extent to interview me (I barely know the kid), my nephew (who lives 2 states away, knows him from visits/IM/e-mails, etc.), I think they look pretty hard before granting clearance.' On topic. Really don't want to. There's a reason I joined the Army (yes, regular Army) in the middle of Desert Storm. My beliefs are mine, my thoughts on the topic are mine. I'm not dancing in the streets, or crying. That's all I'll say.
Ha, my friend started simple PR job for the Army Corp of Engineers and I had to fill out a form and be prepared for in person interviews. They don't fuck around.
In other news, in addition to killing Osama, they also snagged every piece of electronics hardware they could get their hands on. Hard drives, laptops, flash drives, etc. Here's hoping they found a massive stash of porn.
I still feel as giddy as a kid on Christmas morning every time I see the reports of Osama's death. I wouldn't have been one of the assholes running around in the street, posing for the camera's and using the whole thing as a drinking excuse. I don't know if it's really settled in yet. My favorite part is that we found him, we just fucking FOUND him. I think its a bonus we did him in, but the important thing is we know where he was, and that he didn't get away. 2 questions come to my mind now. 1. Was the intent of this mission always to kill Osama? They shot his wife in the calf rather than her face when she charged the SEAL team. The SEALs are capable enough to shoot to wound rather than kill (I know, I know, you never shoot to wound, but fuck, these are SEALs we're talking about. They could blow just your earlobe off from across a field if they wanted to.) I guess a part of me wanted to see him in cuffs, but I trust the government made the right call here just peeling the fuckers cap. 2. Did we really get rid of the body? Come on, it just seems nuts.
No, it shouldn't. It's (at best) second hand ramblings that provide no insight or information into anything. Sure, the guy that may have said it originally on the Facebook Chat might have some issues, with the original chat, but what's been posted on here is of no concern. I will defer to our local OPSEC authority, BrianH, but he's probably busy being debriefed after having taken out Bin Laden with a sling shot at 400 yards while dressed as a goat.
I always love hearing the official story change as time goes on. Im not talking 911 truther shit, but ever since Saddam was hanged it's been a little hobby of mine to track how the government and media craft the sequence of events in any given situation. I remember the video on repeat about Saddams hanging. It was a silent clip of him being lead easily up to the rope, then clipped to him on the gurney dead in a hospital hallway all the while the news anchor quoting the government that the whole ordeal was peaceful and dignified. I youtubed "sadam hanging" to see any foreign reports that would have more details and even then hours after it happened the video phone video of the entire hanging was up with people screaming and the camera man getting an up close shot of his dead face still hanging from the gallows. The same thing is kind of happening here. First bin laden was armed and resisting while his wife was killed being used as a human shield. Turns out he might have been un armed and the woman shot who might or might not have been his wife (depending on the source) was only shot in the calf for rushing the Seals. Just speculation here on my part but Im wondering if they are debating releasing a postmortem photo because it has clues that he was killed with a coup'de'grace execution style shot to the head at close range. There would be some evident gun powder marking if they did. Not trying to get to conspiracy theorist on it but it's something I could see happening. I wouldn't be surprised or upset if it turned out he wasn't shot in the eye but actually to the back of his head Russian style.
It's amazing how so many people fail to see the inherent complexity of communication, nevermind from a military zone. It's not like the Pres was on speakerphone with the guys on the ground. The reports I've seen show that some of the events did happen, but earlier, in the compound outside, with someone other than Bin Laden. I can see how someone could get that confused mere hours after the event when addressing a press conference using second hand information they just heard in an excited environment. Personally, I generally discount any "real time" info and give it a couple of days for the "real" details to make their way out. And laugh at the people who question the details as first reported.
Partly that's an issue with the reporting. The video that they're showing here shows Obama with live tac video and audio feeds from the troops making the entry, and shows some senior military guy in either the same or a very simillar room engaged in what comes across as live communication with entry troops. So much bad or conflicting data that I have no idea what the actual comms situation was, or how much of the footage that they're showing is stock footage from previous events - but I can certainly see how you'd watch the news package they're showing here and think Obama might have personally given the kill order. I imagine that even if the room did have live comms to the entry troops, Obama has enough brains to STFU during a military operation and keep the fuck out of the way.