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Serious Thread: Race Discussion

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Parker, Dec 4, 2014.

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  1. FreeCorps

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    [​IMG]
     
  2. JWags

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  3. Clutch

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    That's a Bullshit project anyway for anyone who's been here more than a couple generations.

    Should have just said Kenya. All of our ancestors came from Kenya if you trace it back far enough.
     
  4. Frebis

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    Kenya, as in "Kenya trace your family back?"
     
  5. MoreCowbell

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  6. Kampf Trinker

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    Going along with the police brutality issue, I know it's come up in this thread that you are allegedly 21 times more likely to be killed by a police officer if you are black. The other stat being thrown around a lot is that in 2012, 123 blacks were shot dead by police and 326 whites were shot dead by police. Of course, whites being the vast majority in this country even going by those numbers you're still at a much higher risk if you are black.

    However, the statistics are most likely bogus.

    Because of the way things are reported right now we're in a situation where people can easily manipulate the data to say whatever they want it to mean. So, if people are looking for solutions we could at least start by keeping proper records. In the event of a violent death you should at least include minimal circumstantial information on the death certificate.

    I just wanted to add this because with all the statistics being reported as these stories unfold there's good reason to take it all with a healthy amount of skepticism regardless of what source you hear it from.
     
  7. ghettoastronaut

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    Or you could do just a tiny bit of googling...

    http://www.bjs.gov/index.cfm?ty=tp&tid=19

     

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  8. Kampf Trinker

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    Sigh. Go back and read the article I linked. Maybe some links in the article too.

    http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/how ... each-year/

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post ... one-knows/

    Yeah, what the fuck do the criminal justice experts know?

    The stats you put forth are so unreliable they don't even bother anymore. I'll stop here.
     
  9. AlmostGaunt

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    If a black institution discriminates against you, maybe someone calls you a hurtful name.

    If a white institution discriminates against you, you don't get decent schooling, jobs, or housing.

    If you think those two things are equal, you need to try and abstract out your thinking a little.
     
  10. ghettoastronaut

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    The BJS report actually states:

    It's not the numbers themselves, it's what you do with them. You can't use these data to show a particular year-on-year trend, but some of the patterns they track and demographics are at least somewhat useful. So if they track that about 32% of reported arrest related deaths are black people, then it's reasonable to say that black people are indeed killed by police at a disproportional rate. It's not 21 times as high, but it's still there. Given that not all areas report, it's a reasonable guess that if all stats were collected, the numbers would look worse, and not better.

    Interestingly, police departments are mandated under a federal law to report all arrest-related deaths, except it isn't enforced (which is why the BJS stats are incomplete). Hopefully this is something that changes.
     
  11. Parker

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    Wait are we debating the voracity of data in regards to if less than 20% of the population gets killed at a higher rate than the rest of the population? Not exactly sure where this conversation is going. I think we've discussed enough things here to see that it is a bad situation out there. There is data that makes it look kinda bad and there is data that makes it look fucking horrible. But any data that suggests everything is okay is full of shit.

    I'm in a data related business, you can bend numbers to color or shade things, but not change them. So I'm not sure what the point is here.
     
  12. Kampf Trinker

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    The point is if they start doing a better job getting the data it won't necessarily solve anything, but it will at least give us a better idea of where we stand. I don't think anyone was saying, 'well look at the data this way and everything is fine.' Like Ghetto said I'm pretty sure the true numbers are worse than those stats indicate, but it would nice to get a better idea what they are and then go from there. I'm guessing minorities get recorded less often than whites.

    The not enforcing data collection is just another problem in a long line of a system that chooses to let cops slide.

    Edit: You've been bitter most the thread about people being ignorant. Well, that's what I was trying to get at with that first article. O'Reilly says "326 white people got shot and 123 blacks got shot to death by cops in 2012. See, everything is fine. There's nothing to be upset about. It's close enough." He's being very misleading, but he can kind of get away with it because of the shitty collection methods.
     
  13. Parker

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  14. katokoch

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    I initially said this in a PM, but I'll go ahead and post it.

    So this was basically written for people like me, I mean look at my post at the top of that page. Half of my gut response to the article (and comments) was to say "Go fuck yourself, I'm trying," and the other half was sitting in a corner very quietly, thinking back on things I've said/posted. Was I/am I trying to say "I'm not racist!"? No. Am I trying to say that I'm making an effort to improve myself? Yes. Does that put me on a pedestal? Fuck no. No it isn't just about me either, I'm trying to think of how my own thoughts and actions can harm or help the much bigger cause. Maybe that's why the dismissive, condescending tone felt so irritating when I'm sincere- ultimately, I'm trying.

    It's a challenge for people like me that grew up in a white world to think and change. I'm getting better, but it's still a challenge. Then again, not as difficult as being black in a white world.
     
  15. Aetius

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  16. Crown Royal

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    Just call me Topher

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    I find it hilarious that iggy would call anybody a bigot, since it's well documented that she is an ignorant racist fucktard. And untalented to boot.

    I honestly don't care about what either of those women say. They BOTH seem like morons.
     
  17. Nettdata

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    They're trying to cash in on the media attention and have nothing of substance to lend to the process... just "look at me" shit.
     
  18. Parker

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    It'd stir up shit if a black artist wasn't accusing a white artist of appropriating music every 6-12 months. This isn't new, it's just funny how their names mirror each other. I don't see either as lasting artists who matter. I really see stories like that and think "Who gives a shit?"
     
  19. Aetius

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    The story amused me because they're throwing so much shit back and forth about white/black, when Banks has made blatantly anti-semitic tweets, and Iggy has made blatantly anti-hispanic tweets. But ain't no one care about Jews and Wetbacks.
     
  20. Parker

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    There are obvious reasons why there isn't heat for those and why there is heat for the anti-black stuff. As I mentioned before, its the weight behind the comments. Black people can't do shit to Jews. I haven't heard any of my hispanic friends say shit about Iggy, nothing has popped up on my social medias about it.
     
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