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The Association: 2012-2013

Discussion in 'Sports Board' started by Trakiel, Oct 17, 2012.

  1. trojanstf

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    I don't know whether he will or won't come back. But Shumpert did go down that same night and is back playing again. Obviously everyone is different but the one year rule for ACLs looks like it needs to be shortened a bit.
     
  2. MoreCowbell

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    OK, but Shumpert didn't just give an interview last week saying he isn't even close to playing shape.
     
  3. Parker

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    No, but guys seriously. Go listen to the fucking podcast. The way Ric Bucher said it, it was a 100% definite "I was told by somebody that knows that he is no coming back under any circumstance." Then to corroborate that, the article comes out on ESPN saying "He's far away from recovering." This isn't a thing to debate anymore, it is 99% fact. The Bulls know they aren't going to get past the Heat, why both trying this year? No Derrick Rose this year. I actually think it is a good idea. Let's not tick another year off his career just so we can run into a buzzsaw EFC.
     
  4. trojanstf

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  5. Nom Chompsky

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    I don't care what Parker says, I think Lebron is definitely one of the best players in the league.
     
  6. MoreCowbell

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    Fixed that for you.
     
  7. Parker

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    Well LeBron has turned on the pseudo-hate. He is exactly where needs to be and only getting better. Still like Kobe and Jordan more. Comparing him to Jordan is absolutely silly. He'll be there when he gets 3 rings in a row, goes and plays basketball, then wins another 3 rings. I don't know who is stopping him this year. If the Bulls had one more piece, it'd be interesting. But everyone else just has great parts but not a great whole.

    Miami is entertaining to watch, I can say that. Their consistent dismantling of OKC basically just hands them the next trophy. LBJ has put together two impressive back to back years. Let's see him keep it consistent for the next 6 then we can talk about Jordan.
     
  8. MoreCowbell

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    For argument's sake:

    LBJ, age 24 - 28: PERs of 31.7, 31.1, 27.3, 30.7, 31.4. Win Share / 48 of 0.292. 3 MVPs, 1 championship, 3 Finals appearances. Probably will win another MVP this year, and is a good bet for a Finals appearance and possibly championship.
    MJ, age 24-28: PERs of 31.7, 31.1, 31.2, 31.6, 27.7. Win Share / 48 of 0.296. 3 MVPS, 2 championships, 2 Finals appearances.

    Unlike Jordan, LeBron will likely not take a two year break at age 30. Given that he started in the NBA at a younger age, he might end up with more impressive totals than Jordan (for example, 28 year old LBJ has scored more points than 28 year old Jordan had).

    I'm not saying LBJ is as good or better. That's the kind of judgement we'll really only be able to make ten years from now, when we have their entire careers to consider. But what I am saying is that given their respective resumes at age 28, if LeBron wins a title this year? The case is strong that LeBron has accomplished more by the same age (less so by years of experience).

    The big advantage for Jordan in the tail-end of their careers is that Pippen was younger, so he was still in his prime while Jordan was in decline. LeBron's going to have the opposite problem: Wade will age and retire first. I like Chris Bosh, but he's not Scottie Pippen.
     
  9. Nom Chompsky

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    Of course, in a year and a half, Lebron might have moved on to another team.
     
  10. MoreCowbell

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    Entirely possible. I'm just making the assumption that he'll be there as long as Wade is, which seems reasonable given his desire to win rings.

    It's unclear to me what his desired location/team would look like down the road. I bet he likes the looks of Kyrie Irving, but going back to Cleveland? Anthony Davis would be a nice combo. Maybe he joins the Clippers with Griffin. Or tries to build an empire in LA or NY by attracting someone there (I assume playing with Melo wouldn't be optimal for either). Who knows?
     
  11. JWags

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    Would the Clips have the cash to carry Griffin, Lebron, and CP3? Cause that would not really be fair. I think it can be assumed that if Lebron went to the Lakers, we would see the collective public find a 6th, hidden, gear of Lebron hate.
     
  12. MoreCowbell

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    As it stands, no. But I bet LeBron would be willing to part with a fair bit of money to play together, if it came to that. Consider that Caron Butler and Odom are making $16.2M this season, while LeBron makes $17.5M.

    The real problem there would be that Griffin is inked, while CP3 is a free agent this season and LeBron is a free agent next season. It's a coordination problem, compared to the 3 players in Miami.
     
  13. Flat_Rate

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    Re: Re: The Association: 2012-2013

    How much money do you think the Lakers would throw at LeBron? Be interested in how much LeBron would have to leave on the table to play with CP3.
     
  14. MoreCowbell

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    Re: Re: The Association: 2012-2013

    Blake's going to take up $19M over the next five years, assuming he maximizes his incentives. CP3 could, in theory, make up to $21M over the next five. That would require LeBron to come in at somewhere around $10-12 million if we want to be in the same total cost ballpark as the Miami trio.

    LeBron is rich. Really, really, really fucking rich. He will potentially retire a billionaire. I'm inclined to think that in the grand scheme of things, a few million dollars doesn't really mean much to him. The Lakers have money, but what will they have as far as players? He doesn't want a re-do of Cleveland.

    The stumbling block here is actually CP3. He's not bringing in the same kind of money LeBron is elsewhere, and he's got a bum knee. The marginal salary dollars matters more to him. Were he to take a pay cut, it makes everything a lot easier. But how do you convince him to do so without the security of signing LeBron at the same time? This contract staggering is a pain in the ass for them.
     
  15. Gator

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    Well I know whose not going to be throwing any money at Lebron.

    Jerry Buss.

    <a class="postlink" href="http://www.latimes.com/sports/lakersnow/la-sp-ln-lakers-jerry-buss-obit-20130214,0,5024446.story" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.latimes.com/sports/lakersnow ... 4446.story</a>
     
  16. Rob4Broncos

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  17. trojanstf

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    Maybe I'm looking at this wrong, but Tim Legler is an idiot.

    Legler: "Knicks need another interior rebounder because Stoudemire isn't a good rebounder"
    Question: "Who would he go in for?"
    Legler: "Well they would have to work him in and play a lot with Stoudemire at the 5"

    So this fuck wants to go get someone and put him in for Chandler, who is far and away the best rebounder on the team and one of the top 5 rebounders in the league.


    I also don't get the Jim Buss hate. Everyone was nutting over how good the Lakers were going to be at the beginning of the season. After the Harden trade everyone was talking about how the Thunder had pretty much handed the conference to the Lakers. The only mistake he made was how the Phil Jackson thing was handled this season, and that he couldn't slap some sense into Dwight. But somehow Mitch Kupchak and Jerry Buss got all the credit for getting Dwight and Steve Nash, but all the blame for the coaching hire goes to Jim Buss. And the sports media just keeps pushing this story as if Jim Buss is the net in line in the Dolan family.
     
  18. Parker

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    And here is where I can happily say "Fuck LeBron James" up the ass, around the block and back around the corner.

    First he comes out and says "Oh I'm just not going to do my pre-game dunks if people are upset about it" (Can't find the exact quote) Then this fucker comes and says "I don't need props, capes, cheerleaders and flight attendants to walk out with me. I just do it. It just happens. Like in a game, if you throw a lob, I'll just figure it out while I'm in the air.

    I'm pretty sure he didn't need an interviewer and an hour special to announce his free agency either. He sure as fuck didn't need a Welcoming Party with lights, smoke and confetti did he? Oh no, but god forbid he takes 30 minutes out of his time to stop being a hypocritical douchebag. Then on top of it he fucking adds "I don't care -- I get criticized for everything," James said. "That's a small thing on my agenda, is that I'm getting criticized for what I do in warm-ups. Stop it." If you participated in the dunk contest, there wouldn't be casual fans criticizing him. Just give the people what they want.

    He's afraid he's going to lose. He doesn't want to be embarrassed so he doesn't join. Even though I'm not sure who could be him, I think he's scared. Fuck LeBron James. Kobe did it, Jordan did it. Let's add this to another reason as to why LBJ will never be thought of as great. Not to mention the fact, that in Jordan's era, there were way more hard fouls. They actually broke down on ESPN on Jordan's birthday that if he played with today's foul rules, he'd average 50. I wonder how LBJ would act if he had people throwing elbows at his ribs or trying to hit him in the nuts everytime he went into the lane.
     
  19. MoreCowbell

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    He won't be considered great because he didn't participate in the dunk contest? Seriously, not because of his on the court performance, but because of a contest that no one has cared about since 2000? And you're taking ESPN's slobber-fest and the "back in my day"-isms regarding Jordan seriously? I can't imagine how pricey your monthly Haterade bill is.

    Counterargument: every single defender that LeBron faces today is more athletic than the average 2 or 3 in the 1985 - 1993 NBA. And MJ did not, in fact, hike a mile uphill in the snow both ways to the United Center. In fact, this entire argument is absurd on its face because it's predicated on the assumption that MJ didn't get every single call every time he went down the court.
     
  20. Parker

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    You took my post a little too seriously. And I will respond with a resolute "Yeah...but still." And for the record, the closest parking lot is at least 20 yard away. With all the snow we got back then...just saying.

    Seriously though, he should just join the goddamn dunk contest. Of the things I'm not going Stephen A. Smith hyperbole about is. 1) He's scared to lose. 2) He should just give the people what they want, because its 30 minutes of his life, and like 2 people ever have gotten injured so there is no excuse.