Probably. But if that's the case why not just deadlift. Light weight. And strengthen those muscles and really work on proper form and technique?
Power Cleans are pretty fantastic for developing leg explosiveness, which comes in handy in a lot of sports. That said they are in no way a deadlift substitute. I'd do both, on different days so you're not too worn out.
I've been tinkering with a 5x5 workout over the last couple of months. This is the split that I've settled on over the last couple of weeks; it's loosely based on the 5x5 split that I've seen on StrongLifts. Feel free to poke any holes or add any suggestions. I also have this book coming in the mail later this week, so there's that. I need to reinforce some of the basics. Spoiler Monday Squat 5 x 5 Bench Press 5 × 5 Leg Curl 5 x 5 Barbell Row 5 x 5 Dips + added weight 5 x 8 Wednesday Front Squat 5 x 5 Standing Overhead Press 5 x 5 Deadlift 5 × 5 Pull-ups + added weight 5 x 8 Friday Squat 5 x 5 Incline Bench Press 5 x 5 Leg Curl 5 x 5 Barbell Row 5 x 5 DB Curl 5 x 5
Looks pretty good to me, man. If I were to drop anything, it would be the Leg Curls. Partly because I hate machines, partly because deadlifting and low-bar squatting should be getting your posterior chain some good work. I wouldn't deadlift 5x5 either. That's a lot of volume for a very taxing lift. What have you heard about the effectiveness of incline bench vs. normal bench? My instinct is to say that incline doesn't work the pec more/differently - I think it just puts the muscle at a mechanical disadvantage. I'm finding it hard to find reputable sources.
That was my concern about the leg curls, as well. I figured it'd be good to have some kind of lower-body pulling exercise on my non-deadlift days, but I may have been overthinking that one. Speaking of squatting low, one of the trainers who was working at my gym tonight came up and told me that I have the best front squat form that he's seen from anyone in there in "at least a year." I go to one of those places where most people lift on the balls of their feet, and rarely go below parallel. I wasn't lifting much, but it felt great to hear, nonetheless. I've heard similar concerns about deadlifting 5x5 as well, but when I mentioned that in a PM to lhprop1 (the TiB Resident Strongman), he dismissed it: "Whoever told you that form breaks down on deadlifts by doing 5 x 5 is a moron. If your form is breaking down, that's because it's a weak lift for you . . . probably because you haven't been doing them enough." I've been lifting very light lately in order to solidify my form (I just did 5x5 of 175 today), so I'm not too worried about injury/overexertion. When I decide to ramp things up later on, I'll probably do 2-3 lighter sets, and 2-3 heavy sets. I'll burn that bridge when I get there, though. The only difference that I've heard (and it's the same distinction I've seen in virtually every lifting forum/website I've read) is that it puts more emphasis on the upper pectoral muscles, which is what I'd like because my chest looks kind of silly: lower half is solid, upper half looks totally deflated. I'd imagine that some incline work would help improve my flat bench, as well.
Gotcha. That's probably fair then. The idea of doing 5x5 of my 5RM deadlift had me spooked, not for form reasons, but in the sense that I'd need to go lie down after every set. (I forgot that 5x5 programs are generally 2 ramping sets and 3 work sets. Clever me.) Also, you're gonna love Starting Strength - an entire chapter dedicated to each of the main lifts, and a nice and easy 5-step deadlift checklist. Never fails. Yeah, that's what I've heard, but usually from the same kinds of people who perpetuate the whole "8 meals a day or say goodbye to your gains" type nonsense. Since I love quoting Rippetoe: I guess the ultimate test is to try it out and see if it makes a difference for you.
How long have you guys been lifting? I ask because I look at Rob's routine and feel like a complete slacker.
I only recently got back into it regularly in December, after a 1.5 year hiatus due to working too much. After I fell out of rhythm, I failed to get back into a respectable gym routine due to hardcore laziness . A little over two years ago, I squatted 300+ for the first time in my life (full squat, like a boss!). I'm nowhere close to that right now. I don't want you to get the impression that I've got my shit together; for the time being, I'm back on my training wheels, figuratively speaking. That's some interesting advice. I didn't incorporate the incline bench until a couple weeks ago, so I can't say with any certainty whether it's worked for me or not. If I feel like I'm wasting my time, I'll simply switch it out for the flat bench. For now, I like the variety. In other news, I plan on buying a couple pairs of very high socks. You know a fabulous way to get strange stares at the gym? Accidentally rip open old deadlift scabs with more deadlifts, then walk around with blood pouring down your shins.
Lifting seriously for about three months. I'm still pretty damn new at this. Spoiler 2 months bulk, 1 month cut. (I've since deloaded my squat to ensure I'm getting proper depth.) This is a pretty good intro article: <a class="postlink" href="http://www.mensjournal.com/magazine/everything-you-know-about-fitness-is-a-lie-20120504" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.mensjournal.com/magazine/eve ... e-20120504</a>
Funny, I was in need of some 5x5 advice on deadlifts as well. When I started working out again with starting strength I switched the squats reps with the deadlift so I was doing dead 5x5 each work out and squats 1x5 once a week. I just felt a lot safer with my form doing deads. I later switched the squats to the two off days and started back with just a bar and did if 3 times until failure, adding five pounds each workout like the usual plan. The deads have been going pretty well, watching all the riptoe videos really help. But as my weights have got heavier I feel like Im shifted back to using my back at the start of the lift. Ive heard curling your toes shifts the weight back to the ball of your feet helping in the "push through" part. Any other good tips on how to keep your back straight and not taxing it?
Do you mean your heels? You definitely don't want the weight to be on the balls of your feet. Push through your heels.
Incline works the shoulders more than flat bench does. It's a nice medium between flat bench (which I have no use for) and overhead pressing. It really helps a lot with overhead press. 20 years or so since I started messing around in my high school gym. I didn't seriously started strength training until 11 or 12 years ago, though. That's almost a decade of prime strenth development that I spent learning that muscle mags are retarded, bodybuilding is 95% broscience, and supplements are a waste of fucking money. If you put in the hours at the gym, do the work, sweat, bleed, and eat and you will be big and strong. We have known this for centuries, yet everyone tries to tell us there's an easier way. There isn't.
Im sorry that's what I meant. Pushing through the heels. Also, length of body segments, riptoe mentions it a lot (I forget the long name), he's usually only talking about guys with long legs and short torsos. I think it's been mentioned here a few times but searching isn't turning up anything. I have short legs, short torso, and I guess regular arm length? How does this normally effect deads?
Different anthropometries will affect the set-up for the lift. The bar should be over the very middle of the foot, scapulas above the bar (shoulders just in front of the bar). I have long arms and a short torso (my fingers extend to about my quad insertion points when standing straight). My deadlift has always kicked the everloving crap out of my other lifts. Ridiculous
Since high school sooo.... about 15 years. High school was pretty specifically about supplementing my training for wrestling, and college was iffy in general due to the lifestyle. I'd say I've been seriously lifting for about six or seven years. The thing is to try a bunch of different routines to find some that you like, and just keep at it. You'll hit a point where you are annoyed when you miss a gym day. Even with something as brutal as deadlifts. In college I never did deadlifts or squats, now those are the days I want to get to the gym the most.
These both reflect my approach to the gym in the last 6 months. I notice an inverse proportion to how much I listen to other people in the gym or in those magazines, and how well my lifts become. It's why 70-page chapters about single lifts convinced me to buy Rippetoe's book. However, what if you don't have much desire to be "big" and strong; what about merely strong? I'm only 5' 7", so I'd prefer not to exceed 180 or so. I think that as long as I stick to lots of meat & vegetables and keep my reps under 5 per set, I won't have to worry about putting on too much mass.
I'm 5'3", and my current approach is, "I'll cross that bridge when I get to it." And that bridge is far, far away. On the note of "getting too big": Does this 19-year-old even lift? Why, yes, yes he does. And he's gonna be in the Olympics, lifting for Albania. And he seems like a really nice kid, too. One to root for.
The best thing to do is to find a training partner or group of guys who is more experienced than you and start training with them. You'll soak up more knowledge and get so much experience that you could never get on your own. Personally, I started doing my strongman training with a perennial World's Strongest Man competitor and have had the good fortune of training with the reigning WSM winner (Brian Shaw) as well as many of the other top strongman competitors in the world on a regular basis. You can never get experience like that from a book, magazine, or the internet. Also, if you truly want to achieve beyond your potential, you should get into a sport. It can be strongman, powerlifting, rugby . . . anything. Having that external factor driving you will push you further than you could ever push yourself just being a recreational lifter. Like RCGT said, cross that bridge when you get there. For me, the deciding factor is what weight I felt comfortable at. I'm a touch over 6'1" and I've found that 230-235 is a very comfortable weight for me. I've been as high as 245 and I just felt sluggish and sick all of the time. Dropping back down to 230ish made me feel healthy again while still not being skinny.
I'm the proud new papa of a pair of these. Spoiler I'm on my way to squat in them for the first time. Wish me luck.